Typology

By Ian Morgan Cron

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Description

Welcome to Typology, a podcast that explores the mystery of the human personality and how we can use the Enneagram typing system as a tool to become our most authentic selves. Hosted by author, speaker, and counselor, Ian Morgan Cron, Typology features interviews with recognized Enneagram teachers, bestselling authors, psychologists, theologians, artists, business leaders, neuroscientists, and others who are using the Enneagram as a path for personal transformation.

Episode Date
049: Julianne Cusick (Enneagram 1) Finds Her Inner Encourager
55:47

As Richard Rohr says, Ones are childlike and full of joy and wonder at the world and creation.  But for Ones, that sense of joy has been lost.  Instead, they suppress their own feelings and focus on being good and doing what is right.  They feel a sense of duty and responsibility and may harbor resentment toward others who don’t see things the right way – their way. 

But what would it look like if Ones reclaimed their childlike wonder? When Ones move toward health, they begin to let judgments go and become more at ease with imperfection. They begin to truly quiet that inner critic and turn it into an inner encourager.

Our guest today, Julianne Cusick, shares how her journey towards self-awareness and self-knowledge as an Enneagram One has allowed her to prioritize relationships over perfection and has given her permission to have fun dancing in the kitchen.

Julianne Cusick is a licensed minister and registered psychotherapist whose passion is to fight for the hearts of women silenced by shame and fear related to their husband’s sexual brokenness. Julianne is a 2nd-year graduate student for a Masters in Marriage and Family Therapy at Argosy University, Denver. She thrives on personal and professional growth.

A dynamic and engaging communicator, Julianne speaks to Christian organizations, women’s groups, and retreats – all from the voice of hope and her own story of healing and redemption.

She is the mother of a high-schooler and young adult son, and enjoys gardening, reading, and spending time with family and friends.

Jun 21, 2018
048: Surrender and Acceptance, feat. Ashley Cleveland
01:13:12

Every single day I receive multiple emails from listeners saying they are stuck and can’t figure out their Enneagram type.  Usually, my first recommendation is to dive into the Subtypes of each number to see if that helps narrow things down. But there is something else to consider…something we have not yet talked about on Typology.  Just as the Enneagram is broken into Triads, it is also broken into Stances--the Dependent Stance, the Withdrawing Stance, and the Aggressive Stance. So, if you’re still conflicted, ask yourself which stance are you? Are you someone who is withdrawing?  Are you someone who is assertive?  Or are you someone who is dependent and more compliant? Because oftentimes when you’re stuck between two or three types they can each feel very different--like they are in conflict with each other.  And when those types don’t fall into the same stance category then knowing your "default stance" can really help iron things out.

On today’s episode of Typology, Ashley Cleveland and I delve into the stances, right-sizing the personality and how surrender and acceptance are the gateways to everything. It’s a great episode you won’t want to miss.

Since her debut on Atlantic Records in 1991, Ashley Cleveland has recorded 9 critically acclaimed albums.  She has won three Grammys for Best Rock Gospel Album (Lesson of Love, 1995; You Are There, 1998; Before the Daylight’s Shot, 2007).  She was the first female to be nominated in that category and the only one to win the award three times.  She has been nominated for six Dove awards and won twice for compilation records (Songs from the Loft: Praise and Worship Album of the year; The Jesus Record: Album of the Year).  She received her fourth Grammy nomination in 2010 for her disc, God Don’t Never Change, a collection of spirituals in the Best Traditional Gospel Album category. Three of her albums have been on Billboard’s year-end best list (Big TownBus Named DesireMen and Angels Say) and she has been nominated twice for a Nashville Music Award (Lesson Of LoveGod Don’t Never Change) winning for Lesson Of Love.  She was named Female Vocalist of the year in 2007 by Christianity Today.net and, in addition to her own recordings, has contributed background vocals on over 300 records over the course of her career.   Her 10th album, One More Song, is due for release late in 2017.

Ashley is currently the subject of a new documentary from Big Branch productions expected to release in early 2018.  The working title is: Who’s The Girl?.

Ashley is a writer/essayist and has written a memoir entitled “Little Black Sheep” which was released September 2013 by David C Cook Publishing and she is currently working on two new memoirs.

Ashley is a native of Knoxville, Tennessee, and lives in Franklin, Tennessee with her husband Kenny Greenberg.  She has three adult children, Rebecca, Henry and Lily.

For more about Ashley, visit www.ashleycleveland.com

Jun 14, 2018
047: Self to Lose, Self to Find, feat. Marilyn Vancil
01:10:41

Our guest today is an Enneagram professional, spiritual director, coach, facilitator, and author who is passionate about the Enneagram personality model and its value in Christian spiritual transformation. Her workshops and retreats focus on how the Enneagram helps people identify barriers to living out their unique expression and experience as one created in God’s image.

This show is packed with great information for those who know your Enneagram type and are interested in learning how to shift your attention and grow in self-awareness.  Today, Marilyn Vancil talks about:

  • the focus of attention for each type
  • what to do when you realize you're locked into a habit of attention and how to break it, and
  • how to know when it's time to wake up and develop a spiritual practice

Marilyn earned her certification as an Enneagram Professional in the Narrative Tradition through Enneagram Worldwide, and has also taken courses on the Enneagram at Loyola University and the Deep Coaching Institute.

She enjoys life in Seattle with her husband, Jeff. For more information about Marilyn, visit www.marilynvancil.com. 

Jun 07, 2018
046: How an Enneagram 8 learns to be vulnerable, feat. Patrick Chappell
59:03

Eights are often called the Challengers, but I like to call them the Protectors or Defenders. Every type has a basic fear and desire coloring the waters of their personality.  The basic fear of an Eight is being not in control of their self. The basic desire is to avoid feeling weak or vulnerable.

But Eights can often be misinterpreted. Though they can often appear blunt and aggressive, Eights are truly about justice and looking out for their tribe and making sure others feel like they belong. Eights have lots of energy.  They are high energy, movement people who like to see things get done. The downside of Eights might be that they are low on the vulnerability side of things. They only trust a small amount of people, and though it may take a lot to get in the trust circle, it doesn't take much for you to get out. It's very hard to get on the list, and then you just have to do one thing and you're off the list.

But what does it look like when an Eight has done their work and views life through the healthy lens of an Eight?  Listen in as Patrick Chappell discusses various triggers and how he approaches them from the lens of an Eight.

Patrick is southern born and bred, having been born in Birmingham and raised in Chattanooga. Patrick earned his degree in Oral Communication and Public Relations from Lipscomb University. He then served as an Admissions Recruiter for the University, traveling the country to bring students to Nashville for a Christian education. He is currently the College and Young Adult Minister at Otter Creek Church in Brentwood, TN.

Patrick is passionate about life, spending many hours reading, going to concerts, taking in movies and his favorite TV shows, as well as spending countless hours over coffee with friends. He's also a big fan of the band Weezer. 

 

 

May 31, 2018
045: An Enneagram 7 Lets Go of His Expectations, feat. Luke Norsworthy
01:02:20

Sevens are the joy bombs of the Enneagram.  The energy they give off is energetic, fun-loving and naturally cheerful. They are optimistic by nature and seize every moment of life. They live for the next adventure and are experts at reframing a negative situation to find the silver lining. 

But all their “living for tomorrow” is really to avoid pain and introspection.  Sevens may have an underlying feeling that if they allow themselves to feel an emotion they’ll get stuck in that emotion never come out.  They keep their minds busy and occupied with projects and ideas for the future in an unconscious attempt to evade having negative emotional or psychological feelings.  

Listen in as we jump into an energetic conversation with Enneagram Seven, Luke Norsworthy, and find out why it’s important for Sevens to enjoy life with a small spoon.

Luke and his wife Lindsay along with their three daughters live in Austin, TX where Luke is the senior minister of the Westover Hills Church. Luke’s first book God over Good releases October 2018. Luke also hosts the Newsworthy with Norsworthy Podcast,  a weekly podcast discussing Spirituality, Christianity, and anything else that seems news worthy.  You can follow Luke on Twitter: @LukeNorsworthy

May 24, 2018
044: Jen Hatmaker’s Fight for Grace using the Enneagram
58:53

The last time I spoke with Jen Hatmaker on her “For of Love” podcast, we talked about how she identifies as a Three. As our conversation continued I began to think, “Man, you’ve got a lot of features of an Eight. I wonder if you should check out this other type.”  

Threes and Eights are both assertive, ambitious, and competitive. But the difference is that an average eight wants to get their way pretty fast because they just don't want to waste time. They're not afraid to get into an argument, but they're like, "Whatever, I just want to get the power and the control in the room here a little bit or in life." They'll compete for dominance, but it's less about social or status issues, it's more about power. For Threes, it's much more about status and appearances.  Threes are less interested in having the power rather they are more interested in being admired by others.  

In today’s episode, we discuss the similarities and differences of Threes and Eights and how that manifests under the umbrella of fighting for justice and grace.  Listen as we talk about Jen’s need to stand up for various social issues, her ability to embrace confrontation for what is just, and the emotional response to doing just that.   

May 17, 2018
043: An Enneagram 8's Process of Defrosting, part 2 with David Gungor
48:31

Last week David Gungor shared his struggle in determining his type, how he embraces his “chaotic intentionality,” and what it means to need others to “get out of his face.”  Today we continue the conversation about how the Enneagram can help Enneagram Eights grow in self-awareness through spiritual practices and leaning into the people they do trust to gain true intimacy.  

David Gungor is a member of The Brilliance, the American worship music duo of David Gungor and John Arndt. The band started making music in 2010 under the Integrity Music label.  Their new album was “All is Not Lost” released in January 2017. David is also an associate pastor at Trinity Grace Tribeca.

For more information about David, visit www.thebrilliancemusic.com

May 10, 2018
042: Practicing Vulnerability as an Enneagram 8, feat. David Gungor
41:28

Enneagram Eights are called The Challenger for a good reason. Eights don’t like to feel controlled and avoid any appearance of vulnerability.  They are naturally confrontational and their combative energy can feel intimidating to others.  But what feels like intimidation to others actually feels like connection to an Eight. Eights express their anger freely, are fueled by high levels of stimulation, and react very strongly against challenging injustices.  And, as you’ll hear from our guest, David Gungor, the “circle of trust” is small but tight. So what does it sound like when an Eight acknowledges their weakness or vulnerability? What does it look like when you break through that tough exterior?

Listen as David Gungor shares his struggle in determining his type, how he embraces his “chaotic intentionality,” and what it means to need others to “get out of his face.”

David Gungor is a member of The Brilliance, the American worship music duo of David Gungor and John Arndt. The band started making music in 2010 under the Integrity Music label.  Their new album was “All is Not Lost” released in January 2017. David is also an associate pastor at Trinity Grace Tribeca.

For more information about David, visit www.thebrilliancemusic.com.

May 03, 2018
041: Who am I if I can't DO anything? feat. Michele Cushatt (Enneagram 2)
59:00

Twos have an amazing way of making other people feel safe and comfortable. They are some of the most caring, supportive and upbeat people I know.  They accept you as you are, aren’t judgmental and create space where people can speak from their hearts and experience. 

Yet, Twos need to be needed but for a Two to admit their own “neediness” is very difficult. They rarely ask for help and don’t know how to receive it when it’s offered.   Instead, they focus their energy on meeting the needs of others. They have to DO things to really feel loved.  Unhealthy Twos don’t know who they are if they aren’t doing things for the people around them.

So, for a Two to grow in self-awareness and gain self-compassion, they need to embrace the truth that we all have needs.  We’re all broken in some way.  And that’s okay.  It just makes us more human. 

In today’s episode, Michele Cushatt joins us to talk about how Twos can stop seeing their wounds as a flaw but rather as portals for deeper connection for others.

Apr 26, 2018
040: Part 2, May the Fours Be with You: A Panel of Enneagram Fours
40:43

This week we continue with our panel of Fours -- Sandra McCracken, Megan Miller, Matthew Perryman Jones, and Don Chaffer. Tune in as we discuss the strengths and challenges of being a Four, and then stick around to the end when Ian and guests pull some guitars down from the studio walls and spontaneously break into a Dylan tune. It's pretty unforgettable.

Apr 19, 2018
039: May the Fours Be with You: A Panel of Enneagram Fours
50:25

For those who are new to the Enneagram or to what life is like as an Enneagram Four, let me just give a 50,000-foot fly-by of the Enneagram Four.  Fours, called the Individualists, sometimes called the Romantics or the Tragic Romantics, these are folks who have a sense that they carry within themselves some deficiency--some irredeemable deficiency--a missing piece in their essential makeup that they can't quite name. It actually elicits or brings up in them this kind of inconsolable longing for the un-nameable missing piece that they're trying to find and recover so that they can feel a part of the world. They feel as though they're disqualified from belonging because they're different from other people. And so, this launches them on a lifelong quest, usually early on with the struggling low self-esteem, I've never met a Four who told me that that was not an issue for them.

And their passion, or their deadly sin, is Envy.  So, what is it that Fours? Fours envy the normalcy, the happiness, and the apparent ease with which other people seem to move in the world. We just look at other people and think they just haven't suffered as much as we have. We just have this perception that other people have had an easier time of it in this life. And that can sometimes give us a little bit of superiority, almost, because we also become addicted to our suffering if we're not careful. It becomes the core of our identity--the tragic story of the past that we don't know how to divorce ourselves from, and even if we could who would we be without it, without that tragic story? God, we'd be ordinary, which of course points to the underlying motivation of the Four which is a compulsive need to be unique and special as a strategy to compensate for what we perceive to be this irredeemable deficiency.

To best illustrate the ways that Fours are unique, even from each other, I brought in a panel of Fours for this week’s show. The thing I love about panels is it's so much better for people to learn about these different types, these archetypes of the Enneagram, straight from the mouths of those who live in the shoes of those different styles of being in the world. Fours are the most misunderstood number on the Enneagram in general. So, tune in as Sandra McCracken, Megan Miller, Matthew Perryman Jones, and Don Chaffer join us in studio to talk about all things Four.

Apr 12, 2018
038: How the Enneagram Unexpectedly Rocked Our World, feat. research psychologist Dr. Richard Beck and his wife, Jana
01:09:48

After a knee-jerk reaction of skepticism, Dr. Richard Beck and his wife, Jana, share how the Enneagram has had a profound effect on their family. In today’s show, we talk about the disjoint of how we conceive ourselves and how we behave on the ground, how personality and virtue cut across Enneagram types, and the unique contribution of the fluidity of the Enneagram.

Richard Beck, Ph.D. is a research psychologist, professor, and award-winning author. His books include: Unclean: Meditations on Purity, Hospitality and Mortality (2011), The Authenticity of Faith: The Varieties and Illusions of Religious Experiences (2012), The Slavery of Death (2013), Reviving Old Scratch: Demons and the Devil for Doubters and the Disenchanted (May 2016), and his newest book, which just released in November, Stranger God: Meeting Jesus in Disguise. To learn more about Richard, visit https://experimentaltheology.blogspot.com or his author page at https://amzn.to/2uKfzEQ.

Apr 05, 2018
037: Part 2 of Exploring "The Shack" with the Enneagram and author Wm Paul Young
47:16

This week we jump back into our conversation with Paul Young to help nail down his type.  Figuring out his type was hard, as it can be for many.  But I think Paul has suffered and worked through so many things in his life, he has reached a point where I think he's maybe one of the most integrated nines I've ever known. Also, because of that, he has a mystical quality.  When they're healthy, nines are so awake there's a mystical quality to them. I think it becomes tough to figure out their type because they're so attuned and plugged in across all these types, but they're awake.  

Paul Young is the author of The Shack (2007), Cross Roads (2012), Eve (2015), and he just released his latest book, Lies we believe about GOD (2017). To learn more about Paul or to check out his books, visit www.wmpaulyoung.com.

Mar 29, 2018
036: Exploring "The Shack" with the Enneagram and author Paul Young, pt 1
50:50

When learning the Enneagram and figuring out your number, one of the things that complicates the process is trauma and the effect of trauma on personality development and theory. I always say, I think personality, just the defensive nature of the personality thickens on people with trauma. The staircase is steeper that we have to climb.

Our guest in this two-part episode is not sure if he's a 9 or a 7. And so during the show, we actually get into it, we actually help Author Paul Young nail it in the second episode.  Paul Young is a human being whose heart and soul are fascinating and are also enriching. I have a special place of affection in my heart for Paul, and I know you’re really going to get a lot out of this show.

Paul Young is the author of The Shack (2007), Cross Roads (2012), Eve (2015), and he just released his latest book, Lies we believe about GOD (2017). To learn more about Paul or to check out his books, visit www.wmpaulyoung.com.

Mar 22, 2018
035: Sarah Thebarge, Moving Out of Fear Into Love as an Enneagram 6
56:20

I’ve said it before, Sixes are wonderful. They have a strong need for security and consistency. They appreciate order, plans and rules and like the comfort and predictability of laws and guidelines.  But Sixes also have a shadow side.  Their passion is fear, which is often experienced as anxiety.  Anxiety is a vague, free-floating sense of apprehension that arises in response to an unknown or potential threat that may never materialize.  So, how do Sixes achieve spiritual growth?

A lot of Sixes think the answer is bravery, but there’s never enough bravery to fill the bucket of “this is a scary world and I need support.” But in today’s episode, Sarah Thebarge shares the difference between bravery and courage and how making that distinction has been helpful for her as an Enneagram Six. 

Sarah Thebarge is a speaker, blogger, journalist and author of The Invisible Girls, a memoir that weaves her story of nearly dying of breast cancer in her 20’s together with the story of a Somali refugee family she met on a train in Portland, Oregon, as she was recovering from her cancer treatments.  

The Invisible Girls is a World Magazine Notable Book and was also chosen as the First Year Experience book by Mississippi State University.  

Her current book, THE WELL: Healing Our Beautiful, Broken World from a Hospital in West Africa, is a deeply personal account of what practicing medicine at a hospital in Togo taught Sarah about how each of us can heal the cracks we see in the world around us. 

Sarah’s blog was featured by MSNBC.com.  Her writing has appeared in National Geographic, USA Today, Everyday Health, Relevant Magazine, Christianity Today, Huffington Post, Red Letter Christian and Sojouorneers.

As a speaker, Sarah is a regular at retreats, churches, colleges and conferences. She has spoken at Donald Miller’s Storyline Conference and the Jubilee Conference, as well as more than 40 universities and colleges.  In addition to speaking to large assemblies, Sarah gives talks on the topics of International Aid, Health Communications and Public Health, and teaches nonfiction writing workshops.  

Mar 15, 2018
034: How to fix your broken record with the Enneagram, Feat. Amena Brown (Type 2)
01:07:17

Every type on the Enneagram has misbeliefs and errant unconscious motivations that get us to do and think and feel things that just are not in our best interests.  We all have these broken messages in our lives that run like recordings in the background. The hurtful words and experiences from our past often determine what record play in our head as an adult.

In her new book, How to Fix a Broken Record, Amena Brown uses music to help us recognize the negative messages that play on repeat throughout our lives.  Think of your soul as one big record collection with a soundtrack for different parts of your life.   What broken record runs through your life?  And how can you use the Enneagram to recognize these negative messages so you can reclaim your life?

Amena Brown is an author, spoken word poet, speaker, and event host. The author of five spoken word albums and two non-fiction books, Amena performs and speaks at events from coffeehouses to arenas with a mix of poetry, humor, and storytelling. She and her husband, DJ Opdiggy, reside in Atlanta, GA.

She hosts a 10-episode limited edition podcast called, “How to Fix a Broken Record,” which unpacks themes from her book with a different guest each episode discussing life, love, faith, and broken records revealing the soundtracks of their lives. https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/how-to-fix-a-broken-record/id1296534604?mt=2

And she hosts her regular podcast “Here for the Donuts” with her sister-in-law Missi Burgess in which they discuss donuts, cupcakes and navigating life’s awkward moments and meeting standards of weird etiquette.  https://itunes.apple.com/mt/podcast/here-for-the-donuts-podcast/id1183039922?mt=2

To learn more about Amena visit www.amenabrown.com or order her book at http://amzn.to/2oUg4WA.

Mar 07, 2018
033: The Enneagram on Tour with Tenth Avenue North
01:37:17

Have you ever wondered what it would be like to go on tour with a band?  It sounds exciting, right? You’d hop on a tour bus, travel coast to coast seeing the world, and entertain thousands of people every night.   

But, what is it truly like to live on a bus with 11 other people day-in and day-out?  Well, when the road manager of Tenth Avenue North reached out to talk about how the Enneagram, and The Road Back to You in particular, has helped their band get along in tight quarters, I was excited to get them in the studio.

There are 12 of them…with 12 bunks…on one tour bus.  We weren’t sure what would happen as we squeezed into Anthony’s studio, but it was great! 

Listen as we uncover how the Enneagram has given Tenth Avenue North a new starting place for communicating and facing conflict.

For more about Tenth Avenue North or to catch them on tour, visit their website at www.tenthavenuenorth.com.

And don't miss them in Nashville on March 4th!

Mar 01, 2018
032: Reading People through the Lens of the Enneagram, with author Anne Bogel (Enneagram 9)
57:27

When Nines are healthy and self-aware, they learn to feel special and important. They get in touch with their own passions and feel secure enough to stand behind their accomplishments. They become assertive and decisive.

But when they switch to autopilot and spiritually fall asleep at the wheel, they doubt themselves and become more pessimistic.

The deadly sin, or the passion of Nines, Sloth, is really about the failure to invest in your own self-development, in your own spiritual maturity, becoming your own person, finding your own voice, and claiming your ground. Nines need to be reminded that they matter. Nines need to do things for themselves, invest in themselves, and not feel like it's a poor investment. 

In her book, Reading People: How Seeing the World through the Lens of the Personality Changes Everything, author Anne Bogel talks about being at peace with who you are. And, of course, who doesn't want that? I mean, I don't know anybody who doesn't want peace with themselves, to have a sense of consonance, a sense of integration despite all of their dings and dents.  Part of the journey for Nines is learning to take action on their own behalf and invest in themselves.

One helpful way for nines to summon self-compassion and find peace with who they are is to imagine what it would be like for somebody else to experience what you are experiencing.  Ask yourself,  "What advice would you give someone else?" Then use that to summon the appropriate action for yourself.

Anne Bogel is the creator of the blog Modern Mrs. Darcy, the voice of the top-rated books and reading podcast "What Should I Read Next", and a bona fide personality geek. Her first book, Reading People: How Seeing the World Through the Lens of Personality Changes Everything, combines her loves of literature and personality frameworks. 

To learn more about Anne Bogel visit www.modernmrsdarcy.com.

Feb 22, 2018
031: Here, Hold My Beer...A Panel of Enneagram Twos
01:09:17

In Enneagram-speak, Enneagram Twos are called The Helpers.  They are some of the most loving, kind, supportive, upbeat, and—when healthy—genuinely helpful to other people.  Their underlying motivation is to feel loved and needed. But sometimes that need to be needed can lead to burn out.

But, why listen to me talk about The Helper when you can hear it from those who actually live it?  In this week’s episode of Typology, I brought together a panel of Twos to describe what it’s like in the mind of The Helper.  So, tune in and listen as the loud-laughing, contentedly uncool mom of three teenagers, Tia Coffey,  Vanderbilt University fundraising specialist and stand-up comic, Geoff Little, and singer-songwriter-author, Andrew Greer join me to talk about finding the balance between giving enough and giving to the point of burn out.

Tia Coffey spends her workdays as an executive assistant, her evenings as a student, and her free time drinking wine, hiking, having theological conversations with friends, or hanging with her kids and an anxious chihuahua named Napoleon. 

Geoff Little works by day as a fundraising specialist at Vanderbilt University, but after hours he spirals into a whirl of outgoing pursuits. He loves spoken word live performances, including stand-up comedy. He is former co-host of TenX9 Nashville, a critically acclaimed storytelling group.  He founded (and still leads) Nashville's  Beer & Hymns public singing group phenomenon, which sells out Nashville rock club Mercy Lounge on occasion (don't miss this year's St. Patrick's Day Pub Sing!).  He is married to his lovely wife, Tara, and on a good day, she lets him jog with her in the nearby Warner Parks, graciously slowing down her pace.  

Andrew Greer is a multiple Dove Award-nominated singer-songwriter and respected author, known for his old soul sound and thoughtful prose. The native Texan-turned-Tennessean’s folk-gospel discography displays a deep affection for vintage spiritual songs, instinctively captured on his critically acclaimed Angel Band hymn series—reaching the Top 10 on Amazon and iTunes’ mainstream charts upon release.

With a love for facilitating conversations that dig deep, Andrew co-created and co-hosts the video podcast, Dinner Conversations with Mark Lowry and Andrew Greer: Turning the Light on One Question at a Time. The conversations-centered series debuted at #1 on iTunes Religion & Spirituality chart last year, and is now syndicated on television nationwide. 

Andrew has also authored two books— Transcending Mysteries: Who is God, and What Does He Want From Us? (Thomas Nelson) co-authored with Ginny Owens, and Winds of Heaven, Stuff of Earth: Spiritual Conversations Inspired by the Life and Lyrics of Rich Mullins (Worthy Publishing).

 

Feb 14, 2018
030: Blowing up the Personality Box, feat. Brian Hardin, creator of the Daily Audio Bible podcast
55:07

Our personality types can put us into an almost hypnotic trance, something I’d call the shadow. We relegate to the shadow those parts of ourselves we don't want to see. What the Enneagram does is it takes a flashlight and it goes into the shadow with you. It says, “Okay, we've got to look around.” It helps us embrace the journey inward. And no, it's not going to be comfortable. It is going to be painful because embracing pain isn’t something we do well. It’s something that we avoid well. But it’s important to feel those things as they come up, not analyze them, not try and figure them out.  Actually just let them be what they are. Let the beautiful things be beautiful and let the painful things be what they are. 

In today’s episode, Brian Hardin talks about his journey through the lens of a Five.  He shares how using the Enneagram as a tool not only gives language to and expands our understanding of each other and of ourselves but also how it helps us pull back the curtain to shed the façade of our personality and find our true self.   

Though best known for founding Daily Audio Bible, the revolutionary Scripture podcast, downloaded over 55 million times, Brian Hardin is truly a man of many hats. With his trademark soul patch of whiskers and wisps of hair framing his face, the Nashville creative rose to recognition throughout the Christian music industry producing for the legendary likes of Larry Norman to modern radio regulars like Jill Parr and Manic Drive, earning hundreds of album credits and a healthy collection of Grammy and Dove Award nominations. Along the way, he branched out into photography, landing everything from music industry publicity shots to portraits and corporate portfolios, alongside an eye for graphic design that found his work featured in Time, CCM, Christian Retailing and Gaither Homecoming (to name a mere handful). It was from within these extraordinary accomplishments that an unexpected professional blow set Hardin on a path toward restored faith, and eventually, vocational ministry. 

 

 

 

Feb 08, 2018
029: An Enneagram State of the Union, feat. Author & Former White House staffer Michael Wear
46:47

About a month ago, I sat down with author and former White House staffer, Michael Wear, to talk about personality, power, and politics.  And I know this is a hot-button topic, but I do think it's an important conversation to have.  When we're talking about the President of United States and want to understand who he/she is, how he/she operates, and why our country is where it is, I think it's fair to begin to just think out loud what is happening here and what does it mean?

So listen in as Michael and I provide some Enneagram insight into the politics of the past and present.  

Michael is the founder of Public Square Strategies LLC, a sought-after firm that helps religious organizations, political organizations, businesses and others effectively navigate the rapidly changing American religious and political landscape.

Michael is a leading expert and strategist at the intersection of faith, politics and American public life. As one of President Obama’s “ambassadors to America’s believers” (Buzzfeed), Michael directed faith outreach for President Obama’s historic 2012 re-election campaign. Michael was also one of the youngest White House staffers in modern American history: he served in the White House faith-based initiative during President Obama’s first term, where he led evangelical outreach and helped manage The White House’s engagement on religious and values issues, including adoption and anti-human trafficking efforts. And, he’s got a new book out titled, “Reclaiming Hope: Lessons Learned in the Obama White House About the Future of Faith in America  in which he provides unprecedented insight into the highs and lows of working as a Christian in government. 

He also writes for The Atlantic, Christianity Today, USA Today, Relevant Magazine and other publications on faith, politics and culture. He serves on the national board of Bethany Christian Services, the nation's largest adoption agency, and holds an honorary position at the University of Birmingham’s Cadbury Center for the Public Understanding of Religion. Michael and his wife, Melissa, are both proud natives of Buffalo, New York. They now reside in Washington, D.C.

For more information on Michael, visit www.michaelwear.com

Feb 01, 2018
028: The Grace of Letting Go—the conversation continues with Michael Cusick (Enneagram 2), Part 2
28:30

Enneagram Twos are part of the shame triad which, for those who are just getting started with the Enneagram, means that ‘shame’ is the go-to emotion for Twos, Threes, and Fours.  Whatever the external manifestation is of—our struggle, our compulsion, our presenting problem, anger, alcohol, buying stuff that you don't need, sex, helping—shame is always what fuels that compulsion because where there's shame, our soul can't rest, in a sense of being loved.  The very thing that we're hungry and thirsty for, which is that kind of deep love for who we are, the shame actually sets us up to never be able to get that.

The antidote to that shame is learning to embrace our failures and shortcomings and accept ourselves as we are. Tune in to part two of my conversation with Michael Cusick as we talk about letting go and finding the freedom to live from a place of self-acceptance.

Michael Cusick is a licensed professional counselor, spiritual director, speaker and author of two books including Surfing for God: Discovering the Divine Desire Beneath Sexual Struggle and Somebody’s Daughter: An Experiential Guide. Having experienced the restoring touch of God in a deeply broken life and marriage, Michael’s passion is to connect life’s broken realities with the reality of the gospel.

In addition to leading Restoring the Soul and equipping Christian organizations around the world, Michael currently serves as an adjunct professor at Denver Seminary. He holds an MA in Biblical Counseling from Colorado Christian University and an MA from the College of Education at the University of Denver. Michael lives with his wife Julianne and two children, in Littleton, Colorado where he enjoys the Rocky Mountains and a host of other outdoor activities with friends and family.

Jan 25, 2018
027: "I'm OK if you're OK" A conversation with Michael Cusick (Enneagram 2) Part 1
28:00

Known as The Helper, or as Michael Cusick prefers to call them, The Giver, Twos can be really great therapists and are maybe the most natural to move into that field, but there's also a lot of things about being a Two that work against that. Twos can care too much for the wrong reasons.  Twos are so wired and attuned to the needs and the feelings of other people that they are often clueless as to what their own are.  They look to other people to take care of their needs without having to acknowledge or articulate them.

A large piece of the journey for Twos is to understand that you do have needs, acknowledge those needs, and actually learn how to articulate them. On today’s show, Michael Cusick talks about how the Enneagram has taught him to become more conscious of when he is over-identifying with those aspects of his personality that aren’t healthy and helps him make different choices. 

Michael Cusick is a licensed professional counselor, spiritual director, speaker and author of two books including Surfing for God: Discovering the Divine Desire Beneath Sexual Struggle and Somebody’s Daughter: An Experiential Guide. Having experienced the restoring touch of God in a deeply broken life and marriage, Michael’s passion is to connect life’s broken realities with the reality of the gospel.

In addition to leading Restoring the Soul and equipping Christian organizations around the world, Michael currently serves as an adjunct professor at Denver Seminary. He holds an MA in Biblical Counseling from Colorado Christian University and an MA from the College of Education at the University of Denver. Michael lives with his wife Julianne and two children, in Littleton, Colorado where he enjoys the Rocky Mountains and a host of other outdoor activities with friends and family.

For more information on Michael, visit www.restoringthesoul.com  or www.michaeljohncusick.com.

Jan 17, 2018
026: Living Out Loud - A Conversation with Jo Saxton
01:05:17

Healthy Eights are great friends, exceptional leaders and champions of those who cannot fight on their own behalf. They have the intelligence, courage and stamina to do what others say can’t be done. And, as with most Enneagram Eights, Jo Saxton is full of Eight's life-giving energy so when she was available for our podcast, I jumped at the chance to interview her.

When healthy, Eights learn to open their hearts like a healthy Two. And today, Jo shares how she peeled back the layers, let down her defenses and got in touch with their inner heart. Listen in as we discuss healing broken identities and using the Enneagram as a tool for breaking through the junk that we accumulate and that confuses us from seeing who we truly are. And at the end of the show,  Jo Saxton shares some tips for Eights who are just beginning to do their work and how they can begin to grow beyond their broken identity, or their broken personality, into their best self.

A few things about Jo...she's a really popular leadership trainer. She's an international speaker. She's a best-selling author. She's passionate about seeing God transform lives across the globe. I mean, she's been featured at conferences like If, Catalyst, Thrive, Propel.  She also chairs the board of international discipleship organization called 3D Movements, and cohosts the Lead Stories podcast.

Her latest book, The Dream of You: Let Go of Broken Identities and Live the Life You Were Made For is set to release on January 23, 2018.

For more information on Jo, visit www.josaxton.com

Jan 11, 2018
025: Life, Family and the Enneagram with the Crons
01:14:33

"Compassion is a verb." - Thich Nhat Hanh

The Enneagram helps us recognize and overcome self-defeating patterns of behavior by challenging us to bravely explore who we really are. As we grow in self-awareness we pave the way for our wiser and more compassionate self.  Instead of banging guardrail-to-guardrail through life hurting those in our path, the Enneagram allows us to build and sustain healthy relationships by appreciating and understanding our own motivations and behaviors as well as those of our friends and family. 

In today’s episode, the Cron Family gathers over the holidays to discuss how the Enneagram has helped them grow closer and understand each other better. Listen as they share how their family finds balance and appreciation among each other.   

"The beginning of love is the will to let those we love be perfectly themselves, the resolution not to twist them to fit our own image. If in loving them we do not love what they are, but only their potential likeness to ourselves, then we do not love them: we only love the reflection of ourselves we find in them." - Thomas Merton

Jan 04, 2018
Episode 24: Part 2 - Science Mike hacks the Enneagram
33:41

This week on Typology, we continue our conversation with 'Science Mike' McHargue. This show is bursting with wisdom about Nines.  You'll learn how Nines can spiritually wake up and leverage their unleashed energy for some really cool things, what a Nine looks like in Right Action, and hear some great tips at the end for growing in your journey.  

Mike McHargue (better known as Science Mike) is an author, podcaster, and speaker who travels the world helping people understand the science of life's most profound experiences. His bestselling debut book, Finding God in the Waves, has helped thousands understand faith in the 21st century.

Mike hosts Ask Science Mike, a weekly question and answer podcast helping hundreds of thousands explore the questions they've always been afraid to ask.

He also co-hosts The Liturgists Podcast with his friend Michael Gungor. With over a million downloads per month, The Liturgists Podcast is reshaping how the spiritually homeless and frustrated relate to God.

And his bestselling debut book, Finding God in the Waves, has helped thousands understand faith in the 21st century.

To learn more about Science Mike, visit www.mikemchargue.com

Dec 21, 2017
Episode 23: Science Mike hacks the Enneagram
41:30

Enneagram Nines, or The Peacemakers, are open and receptive in every way. They can see both sides to everything and they have a profound awareness of the interconnectedness of all things in creation.  Their unconscious motivation is to avoid conflict at all costs, to maintain a relational connection, maintain the status quo, and preserve inner peace and harmony. 

To preserve this inner peace and harmony, Nines create internal and external boundaries.  The inner boundary is to tamp down any feelings or desires that might disturb their calm inner sea.  The external boundary exists to protect them from anything external that might cause inner tumult. This desire for inner and outer peace is so innate that Nines unconsciously absorb other people’s emotional energy. 

Today on Typology, our guest 'Science Mike' McHargue shares his journey through the inner sanctum of a Nine and his process of building a healthy connection to anger.  Mike provides so much insight into the life of the Peacemaker we had to make it a two-part show. 

Mike McHargue (better known as Science Mike) is an author, podcaster, and speaker who travels the world helping people understand the science of life's most profound experiences. His bestselling debut book, Finding God in the Waves, has helped thousands understand faith in the 21st century.

Mike hosts Ask Science Mike, a weekly question and answer podcast helping hundreds of thousands explore the questions they've always been afraid to ask.

He also co-hosts The Liturgists Podcast with his friend Michael Gungor. With over a million downloads per month, The Liturgists Podcast is reshaping how the spiritually homeless and frustrated relate to God.

And his bestselling debut book, Finding God in the Waves, has helped thousands understand faith in the 21st century.

To learn more about Science Mike, visit www.mikemchargue.com

 

Dec 14, 2017
Episode 22: Claire Diaz-Ortiz, Sorry...wrong number?
50:19
A lot of listeners have reached out asking “how do I figure out my type?” And though I would love to give the answer, the truth is it can be very difficult to figure out one’s Enneagram number. You are the only one who can truly determine your own Enneagram number because only you can identify the underlying motivation that drives the way you view the world. The real determining factor is not what you do, but rather why you do it. And, frankly, sometimes that can take a lot of internal work. In fact, I can’t tell you how many people have told me they thought they were one number, but after really doing their work, figured out they had misidentified themselves. With so many variables it’s easy to do.
 
So, I often tell people that the best way to learn the Enneagram or to figure out your number is through the narrative. Read about the Enneagram, attend an Enneagram conference, and listen to others share their stories. It's truly the best way to distinguish between the nuances of each type.
 
And this week on Typology, our guest Claire Diaz-Ortiz shares her story.  Listen as Claire tells us about her life as it relates to the Enneagram. For years she's been seeing her life through the lens of an Enneagram One. But, is she truly an Enneagram One? Stay tuned through the end of the show as we leave her with some food for thought.
 
Claire Diaz-Ortiz (@claire) is an author, speaker and Silicon Valley innovator who was an early employee at Twitter. Named one of the100 Most Creative People in Business by Fast Company, she holds an MBA and other degrees from Stanford and Oxford and has been featured widely in print and broadcast media. She writes a popular business blog at ClaireDiazOrtiz.com and is the award-winning author of eight books that have been published in more than a dozen countries.
Dec 07, 2017
Episode 21: Why Didn’t Matthew Perryman Jones Get the Memo?
01:09:55

Fours are the most complex of all the types on the Enneagram. They spend their lives feeling different and separate from others and long to be understood and appreciated for their authentic self. Fours experience themselves as people who are missing something essential at their core that they just can’t put their finger on.  As Tim Burton describes it, “if you’ve ever had that feeling of loneliness, of being an outsider, it never quite leaves you.”

Fours also have a considerable emotional range. They don’t have feelings, they are their feelings and those feelings form the basis of their identity.  This unique gift of being so connected to their emotions  allows them to experience a truly rich interior life. It heightens their creativity and acute sensibility to aesthetics, to beauty and meaning.

In this episode, we invited singer-songwriter Matthew Perryman Jones to share his experiences growing up as an Enneagram Four. Not only does he describe that feeling of being unique but he also shares his song, “Oh Theo,” which truly captures the world view of a Four.

Originally from Pennsylvania, Matthew grew up in Georgia and cut his artistic teeth in the Atlanta music scene before heading north to Nashville. His debut release, Nowhere Else But Here, dropped in 2000, followed by three subsequent albums — Throwing Punches in the Dark (2006), Swallow the Sea (2008), and Land of the Living (2012) — three additional EPs and a handful of singles. Songs from across his catalog have been featured in dozens of film and TV placements, and tours have taken him across the U.S. and abroad to share stages with legends like Shawn Colvin and Patty Griffin, as well as the Ten Out of Tenn songwriter collective of which he is a part.

Now, Matthew is embarking on what might be the ultimate test of his inner compass: making his fifth album with only himself, a guitar, some basic recording gear, and genius loci — the spirit of place. As he chases the ever-retreating horizon, Jones will stop, listen, and capture when and what the spirit of each place calls out to him.

To learn more about Matthew, visit www.mpjmusic.com.

Nov 30, 2017
Episode 20: Becoming Lisa Whelchel
01:01:48

Enneagram Threes focus on outstanding performance, being perceived as successful and avoiding failure at all costs. They believe that love comes from achievement, image, and status and have the tendency to neglect or ignore the personal needs of self and others.

But when Threes move toward health they move to the high side of Six.  When that happens they no longer need to “drive the bus” or flaunt success. They are so good at helping others live into their full potential and be successful in their own right, and not have it be all about their own success.

In this episode, Lisa Whelchel discusses her journey toward being a healthy Three.  Listen in as she touches on her subtypes, how she identifies her True Self, and how the Enneagram has impacted her  life as an introverted Type 3 with a 2 wing.  

Lisa is an actress, author, international speaker, and life coach. Perhaps best known for her starring role as Blair Warner on NBC’s “The Facts of Life” for nine years, she’s also the author of “Creative Correction” which has sold over 200,000 copies and has written more than a dozen books.  Currently, Lisa is a certified CoActive Life Coach and focuses most of her time these days coming alongside others on their transformational journey to remembering their True Self.

For more information please visit www.LisaWhelchel.com and www.ContigoLifeCoach.com.

Nov 16, 2017
Episode 19: Andy Root, The Hysterical Analytical Enneagram Five"
01:04:31

Enneagram Fives are known as the Investigators, or the Observers.  They see the world as intrusive, overwhelming and draining.  They prefer to observe life from the sidelines rather than jumping in and participating in it. They value their privacy and freedom and can feel consumed, or drained, by prolonged involvement with other people or by having too many expectations placed on them.  They monitor the amount of time they spend with others and hightail it back to the realm of the mind whenever possible to refuel. 

But, Fives are alert, insightful, and curious. When it comes to doing their 'work', Fives have an advantage over the rest of us.  Their love for solitude makes them natural contemplatives and their deep need to collect knowledge and information can lead to true self-awareness. These healthy Fives are likely to have depth in knowledge in several areas of their lives and they willingly share their findings with others.

And you'll hear that in action on today's episode.  My guest Dr. Andrew Root proves he has done his work. Listen in as he opens up and shares how he navigates life through the lens of an Enneagram Five. 

Andrew Root (Ph.D., Princeton Theological Seminary) is the Carrie Olson Baalson Associate Professor of Youth and Family Ministry at Luther Seminary in St. Paul, Minnesota. A former Young Life staff worker, he has served in churches and social service agencies as a youth outreach associate and a gang prevention counselor.  He writes and researches in areas of theology and youth ministry.  His most recent books are Christopraxis (Fortress Press, 2014) and Bonhoeffer as Youth Worker (Baker, 2014) and The Grace of Dogs: A Boy, A Black Lab, and a Father's Search for the Canine Soul, released June 7, 2017.

Nov 09, 2017
Episode 18: Matt Carter, An Enneagram Skeptic Finds His Number (And So Can You!)
01:22:28

I’ve received lots of emails and messages from folks on social media who are struggling to nail down their Enneagram number. Well, let me tell you, if that’s the case for you, this show is spot on.

While only you can determine your own type, there are some things you can do to help get clarity.  For those out there who are trying to figure out their type it’s often helpful to read up on wings.  Wings are the number on either side of your number.  Each of these wings will have a different influence on your type.  I would also encourage folks to go to Beatrice Chestnut’s book, The Complete Enneagram: 27 Paths to Greater Self-Knowledge and go through the section where she describes the different subtypes.  This will really provide some insight and help you nail down that number.

But, what does it look like when that process comes to life?

On today’s show we break it down with Enneagram skeptic, Matt Carter. Matt Carter is a musician, podcaster, and entrepreneur based in Seattle, WA.   His career in the music industry began as lead guitarist of the post-punk/hardcore band Emery. His background as a touring musician laid a foundation for various collaborative ventures, including the founding of BadChristian Media and Jabberjaw Media. Matt hosts the wildly popular The BadChristian Podcast and Break it Down Podcast. He continues to tour and perform in Emery and Matt & Toby.

When we started the show, we had no idea where the interview would take us. And, let me warn you in advance, this show is unlike any I’ve done in the past. In fact, it was so cool that when we wrapped up, Anthony and I were so psyched we laughed out loud.  So, strap yourselves in, put on your crash helmets, and let’s get to it.

Nov 02, 2017
Episode 17: Take Five! A Panel of Enneagram 5s with Lori Chaffer, Kenny Benge and Joel Miller
01:17:13

On this week’s show we invited a panel of Enneagram Fives into the studio to describe how they see and experience the world. Called the Investigators, or the Observers, Fives are kind, perceptive, sensitive, calm in a crisis and often possess a sly, slightly cynical sense of humor that’s endlessly entertaining.

But, they can also come across as detached from their feelings, or aloof, unless they feel safe to share their emotions. Fives are often the most misunderstood number on the Enneagram.

So, we asked our guests, singer-songwriter Lori Chaffer, Sr. Associate Pastor Kenny Benge, and writer/editor Joel Miller to share their wealth of knowledge and insights about being a Five.

Oct 26, 2017
Episode 16: Sleeping At Last, Grace Requires Nothing of You
45:32

I think there are truths which reveal the limitations of human language. And when this happens we have to rely on artists to express these great spiritual insights through an alternative language--like music or film or the visual arts or dance--to say clearly what the rest of us only feel vaguely.  So, when I heard Ryan O’Neal, otherwise known as Sleeping At Last, was writing songs from the perspective of each of the Nine Enneagram Types, well as you can imagine, I was pretty intrigued.

On today’s show, Sleeping At Last joins us to talk about this intriguing and wonderful series of new music and shares his song titled, “ONE” from the project, ATLAS: Year Two. You’ll love hearing not only his music but also hearing his heart which I think is, well, evidently magnificent.

Sleeping At Last is the moniker of Chicago-based singer-songwriter, producer and composer, Ryan O’Neal.  In 2013, Sleeping At Last began the long-form concept project, Atlas, which is an ongoing series of new music (EPs, Singles, etc) to be released over the course of several years. Atlas: Year One (30 songs) was completed in early 2014. Sleeping At Last is currently working on Atlas: Year Two.

Sleeping At Last can be heard frequently on popular TV Shows and Films such as The Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn – Part 1, The Fault In Our Stars – Trailer, Grey’s Anatomy, So You Think You Can Dance, Criminal Minds, Bones, The Vampire Diaries, J.J. Abrams & Alfonso Cuaron’s Believe and many more. (Click here for complete list)

Oct 17, 2017
Episode 15: Richard Rohr, Finally Getting Over Your "Self" with the Enneagram, pt. 2 (Enneagram 1)
37:46

On last week’s episode of Typology, I had an amazing conversation with my friend, Fr. Richard Rohr, renowned Enneagram expert and Franciscan Priest, and Executive Director for the Center for Action and Contemplation in Albuquerque, New Mexico.  We discussed the difference between the true-self and the false-self and explained how the Enneagram can guide us on our journey toward identifying our own true-self.

This week on Typology, Richard and I continue that conversation. Today, we talk about how to use the Enneagram on a daily basis as a framework, or a blueprint, for spiritual formation.  Richard also offers words of encouragement and caution for each Enneagram type. 

For more enriching wisdom from Richard visit the Center for Action and Contemplation (CAC) and sign up for Richard’s daily email that goes out with all kinds of wonderful wisdom and thoughts from him. You can also buy a few of Richard’s books. A few of my favorites are The Naked Now, Breathing Under Water, Falling Upward, and Immortal Diamond.

Oct 12, 2017
Episode 14: Richard Rohr, Finally Getting Over Your "Self" with the Enneagram, pt. I (Enneagram 1)
37:49

I first encountered the Enneagram when I was a graduate student at a conservative seminary. While on a weekend retreat I came across a copy of Fr. Richard Rohr’s book, Discovering The Enneagram: An Ancient Tool for a New Spiritual Journey. In that book Richard describes the traits and the underlying compulsions of each of the nine basic Enneagram types. Based on my life experience and what I’d learned in my training to become a counselor, Rohr’s description of the types blew my mind.  They were uncannily accurate. I felt sure I had stumbled on an amazing resource, not only for Christians but for all people. Little did I know, that 25 years later, Richard and I would be friends and the Enneagram would become the central focus of my work.

In this episode, you will learn:

  • How Richard discovered the Enneagram
  • How to break the shackles of self-doubt with self-compassion
  • What exactly is the true self vs. false self
  • Why the Enneagram can help to identify the true-self

Richard is a Franciscan priest of the New Mexico Province and he is the founder of the Center for Action and Contemplation (CAC) in Albuquerque, New Mexico. He is the author of numerous books, including Everything Belongs, Adam’s Return, The Naked Now, Breathing Under Water, Falling Upward, Immortal Diamond, and Eager to Love: The Alternative Way of Francis of Assisi.  

Oct 05, 2017
Shauna and Aaron Niequist on Nurturing Relationships with the Enneagram (Enneagram 4 and 7)
01:02:22

Recently I came across an intriguing article in the Huffington Post about a group of Harvard researchers who undertook a longitudinal study to answer the questions, “͞What are the secrets to a happy and purposeful life?” and “How do we grow and change, what do we value as time goes on, and what is likely to make us happy and fulfilled?”

What do you think the researchers said was their most important finding?

It was that love and relationships are really all that matters.

A person could have a successful career, money and good health, but without supportive, loving relationships, they wouldn’t be happy.

If it’s true that relationships are all that really matter in life, then how do we create ones that are healthy and life giving? And for the sake of our conversation, how can the Enneagram help support our us?

To explore these questions, I asked my longtime friends Shauna and Aaron Niequist to join me on today’s show to talk about how they’ve used the Enneagram to support and nurture their relationship.

For those of you who don’t know them, Shauna is the New York Times bestselling author of the book “͞Present Over Perfect,” and Aaron is a worship leader and the author of a new book to be released next August.  As you’ll soon discover these two people are veteran Enneagram students and incredibly funny to boot!

So, sit back, relax, and enjoy the conversation.

Suggested Reading

͞The Enneagram in Love and Work, by Helen Palmer

͞The Everyday Enneagram, Lynette Shephard

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

 

Sep 28, 2017
Episode 12: I Know My Type...Now What? Continuing Our Conversation with Beatrice Chestnut
53:36

A few weeks ago, renowned Enneagram teacher and author Dr. Beatrice Chestnut joined me on our show to discuss how Enneagram Twos see and relate to the world. Beatrice was so great that we were flooded with requests to have her on again, and thankfully she agreed or we would’ve had a mutiny on our hands!

On this episode Beatrice and I tackle the question “How do I use the Enneagram as a tool for personal and spiritual transformation?”

It’s a great question. Information isn’t transformation. If you want to use the Enneagram as a blueprint for change then knowing your number is only the first step. So today Beatrice and I discuss a few of the many next steps we can take to bring about positive change in our lives through using the Enneagram.

A student of the Enneagram system of personality since 1990 and a past president of the International Enneagram Association, Beatrice is the author of my all-time favorite Enneagram book, The Complete Enneagram: 27 Paths to Greater Self-Knowledge.

So, take a seat, put your napkin on your lap, and get ready for a feast of Enneagram wisdom!

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

Sep 21, 2017
Episode 11: Chris Heuertz, The Enneagram—Sacred Map to the Soul
58:10
The number of self-proclaimed “Enneagram experts” appears to be on the rise these days so I was thrilled when I learned my friend and master Enneagram teacher, Chris Heuertz, was writing a book on using the Enneagram as a tool for personal and spiritual transformation. 
 
Chris is the real deal. He was first introduced to the Enneagram fifteen years ago in the slums of Cambodia, and it forever changed his life. Since then he has dedicated countless hours to studying what he calls this “sacred map of the soul," and shared it with people at workshops and retreats around the world.
 
You’re going to walk away from this episode with more new insights into the Enneagram than you can shake a stick at. Listen in as Chris, my guest co-host Rabbi Evan Moffic, and I talk about understanding the ‘why’ behind your type, how to identify and find freedom from self-destructive patterns, how to grow in spiritual discernment, how to face your past wounds and find healing, how to awaken your gifts to serve today’s broken world, and about Chris' new book The Sacred Enneagram: Finding Your Unique Path to Spiritual Growth.
 
I was fortunate enough to receive an advance copy of The Sacred Enneagram: Finding Your Unique Path to Spiritual Growth and I can’t recommend it highly enough. It’s a feast of Enneagram wisdom!
 
Suggested Readings:
 
 
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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

Sep 14, 2017
Episode 10: So Six-y it Hurts (A Panel of Sixes)
01:09:53

The more I know about life and people, the more I love Enneagram Sixes. Called Loyalists, Sixes are the most faithful and dependable people on the Enneagram. They keep a watchful eye over us. They safeguard our values. In my opinion, they're the glue that holds our world together. And, by the time this episode is over, you’re going to understand why Enneagram Sixes have a reputation for being some of the funniest people on the planet.

But wait! There’s another reason why you need to listen to this show! A few weeks ago, I hosted a panel of four Enneagram Nines, all of whom happened to be guys. At the end of that episode, I promised I would soon host a show with four women.

Well, today’s the day!

For this week's Typology, I brought together Jill Phillips, Leslie Jordan, Francie Likis, and Katie Williams to describe what it’s like to be Enneagram Sixes.  You're going to love and admire this remarkable group of women.

So sit back, hit play, and listen to this wonderful group of women talk about how they see and experience the world. You’ll enjoy every minute of it.

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

Sep 07, 2017
Episode 9: Beatrice Chestnut, An Enneagram Two’s Journey Toward Finding Real Love
51:23

Enneagram Twos are some of the most caring, kind, supportive, upbeat, and tenderhearted people on God’s good green earth. Three of my closest friends are Twos, and together they radiate enough love and generosity of spirit to heat a metroplex. In Enneagram-speak they’re called The Helpers.

On today’s episode, I’m joined by renowned Enneagram teacher, author, consultant, and Enneagram Two, Dr. Beatrice Chestnut Ph.D.  A student of the Enneagram system of personality since 1990, she is the author of my all-time favorite Enneagram book, The Complete Enneagram: 27 Paths to Greater Self-Knowledge.

Enneagram Twos are far more complicated than they appear at first glance. Who better to describe what it’s like to be a Helper than a Black-belt Enneagram expert and teacher. Beatrice was so good we decided to record two shows with her! Whether you’re a Two or not, this show contains so much insight into the Enneagram it will blow your mind!

Beatrice has taught at Northwestern University and was trained in group facilitation at Stanford University’s Graduate School of Business. She served as President of the International Enneagram Association from 2006-2007 and teaches workshops on the Enneagram internationally, focusing on using it as a tool for leadership development and personal transformation.

Books and Resources for Enneagram Twos

Boundaries: When to Say Yes, When to Say No-To Take Control of Your Life, Dr. Henry Cloud

How to Love (Mindful Essentials), Thich Nhat Hanh

Aug 31, 2017
Episode 8: Jeff Goins, Image Isn’t Everything (Enneagram 3)
01:06:14

In 1991, tennis superstar Andre Agassi appeared in a television ad for a camera called the Canon Rebel. On the set, the fashionably dressed Agassi steps out of a white Lamborghini sports car, lowers his ray bans halfway down the bridge of his nose, gazes cockily into the camera, and says, “Image is everything.”  

I watched that old commercial on YouTube the other day and thought to myself, “Wow, that guy’s a poster child for all the not very self-aware Enneagram Threes in the world.”

Enneagram Threes are called The Performers. These folks are success-oriented, image conscious, and wired for productivity. They are motivated by a compulsive need to succeed or to appear successful, and to avoid failure at all costs.

Performers see a world that values people more for their accomplishments, for what they do, not for who they are. Driven by the need for approval and admiration, Threes focus all their energies on winning and looking good doing it.  

As you listen to today’s show, you’ll realize that there’s a lot to love about Threes when they’re healthy, and my guest Jeff Goins proves my case. He's doing all the necessary work (or dare I say ‘successfully’ doing the work) to become his most authentic self.

Jeff is an award-winning blogger, sought after speaker, and best-selling author of five books. He teaches online courses and is pretty sure he makes the world’s best guacamole. He lives with his family here in Nashville, and more importantly, he’s my friend.

SUGGESTED READINGS:

Becoming Who you Are, by James Martin, SJ

Immortal Diamond: The Search for Our True Self, by Richard Rohr

Abba’s Child: The Cry of the Human Heart for Belonging, by Brennan Manning

Life of the Beloved: Spiritual Living in a Secular Age, by Henri J.M. Nouwen

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

Aug 24, 2017
Episode 7: Give Peace(makers) A Chance. A Panel of Four Enneagram 9's
01:21:09

I’m not kidding when I say Enneagram Nines (The Peacemakers) are well represented in my universe of relationships. My wife Anne is a Nine. My daughter Maddie is a Nine, and as you’ll soon learn, a disproportionate number of my friends are Nines as well.

On this week’s show we decided to try something new. We invited not one but a panel of FOUR Enneagram Nines into the studio to describe what it’s like to be members of the Peacemaker tribe. Why host a panel?

In my experience, people learn more about different Enneagram types when they hear people who self-identify as that type talk about their lives. Why listen to me talk about a type when you can hear from folks who live it everyday?

This week you’ll meet four of my closest friends—Singer-songwriter Andy Gullahorn, guitarist, businessman, (and five time Grammy nominee) Randy Williams, Sobriety Coach and counselor David Hampton, and Chris Gonzalez, PhD, a Marriage and Family Therapist, and Director of the MFT program at Lipscomb University.

We honestly didn’t know what would happen when we stuffed me, my guest co-host Rabbi Evan Moffic, my producer Chad Michael Snavely, and four others guys into our tiny recording studio with a six pack of beer but as you’ll soon hear -- it was magic. This is one of the most entertaining and enlightening shows I’ve ever been a part of.

My panel today happens to be all men, but we’ve already scheduled a panel of four women to be on the show in the next few weeks and a mixed gender panel as well, so keep your eyes and ears open for those shows!

​​Suggested Readings for Enneagram Nines:

Living Forward: A Proven Plan to Stop Drifting and Get the Life You Want, by Michael Hyatt

- The 5 Second Rule: Transform Your Life with Everyday Courage, by Mel Robbins

Be sure to listen to Episode 24 of The Road Back to You Podcast with Enneagram Nine Chris Gonzalez. My wife, Anne, is a Nine and she’s listening to it!

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

Aug 17, 2017
Episode 6: Enneagram 8 Melissa Greene, The Velvet Hammer
48:58

Enneagram Eights (The Challengers) are hard driving, tough, decisive, innovative, and resourceful people who make things happen. They’re larger than life presence and boundless energy instills confidence in others, and people follow them. As long as they’re a man, that is.

Our culture reveres male Eights. People admire men who “kick ass and take names.” Sadly, we all know the word folks use to describe a woman who takes charge, stands up for what she believes, refuses to take crap from people and gets the job done. I don’t need to spell it out for you, right? All to say, emale Eights are arguably the most misunderstood and unfairly treated number on the Enneagram.

On today’s episode of Typology, I talk with pastor, activist, musical artist, and Enneagram Eight, Melissa Greene. Affectionately called the ‘The Velvet Hammer’ by her friends and fans, Melissa is true to her type. In our conversation, Melissa shares her challenging but often humorous journey as a female ight who grew up and still lives in the American South--a culture in which women are expected to be sweet and gentee...ot made of steel.

You can find more of Melissa’s current work through Hope Curator for Timothy’s Gift (http://timothysgift.com/) hich curates concert tours with other artists designed to entertain and uplift those in maximum security prisons. Melissa is also the Cofounder of Imaginarium (www.imaginarium.life)—a fresh expression of a spiritual community in Nashville.

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

Aug 10, 2017
Episode 5: Lee C. Camp, An Enneagram 1's Journey toward Embracing Progress, Not Perfection
01:04:55

"Perfectionism is the voice of the oppressor, the enemy of the people,” writes author Anne Lamott in her beautiful book, Bird by Bird: Some Instructions on Writing and Life. Whether you struggle with perfectionism in general, or in just one or two areas of your life, you know how draining and torturous it can be. Are there ways to overcome the tyranny of perfectionism? Is it possible to quiet or tame the negative self-commentary of our inner critic? How can we stop harshly judging ourselves and others, awaken self-compassion, and find peace in our "perfectly imperfect world?"

No one's more qualified to discuss the perils and perks of being a perfectionist quite like a mature Enneagram One, a.k.a. The Perfectionist. On today’s episode, my dear friend and wise Enneagram One Dr. Lee Camp shares how everything changes for the better when we live by the wise motto “progress, not perfection."

If you’re looking for a book to go along with the theme of today’s episode, start here:

The Gifts of Imperfection: Let Go of Who You Think You're Supposed to Be and Embrace Who You Are—Brené Brown

Loving What Is: Four Questions That Can Change Your Life—Byron Katie

And then don’t forget to check out our guest Lee Camp's book, Mere Discipleship: Radical Christianity in a Rebellious World.

Be sure and check out what Lee’s doing with the Token Show at TokensShow.com.

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To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.
Aug 03, 2017
Episode 4: Tsh Oxenreider (Enneagram 4), The Art (and Angst) of Living an Unconventional Life
45:08
Most Enneagram teachers I know say Enneagram Nines are the least complicated of all numbers on the Enneagram, while Fours are the most complicated number on the Enneagram. With Fours, what you see is never what you get. There’s always layers and layers of stuff going on beneath their surface.
 
On today’s episode of Typology, I talk with popular blogger, podcaster, author, and fellow Enneagram Four, Tsh Oxenreider. This conversation is a blast and I think you’re going to love it. And you’re going to learn some really helpful things about Fours in the process.
 
Connect with Tsh at her website, TheArtOfSimple.com, and be sure to check out her new book, At Home in the World. Oh and after you’ve finished listening to our conversation, be sure and check out Tsh’s wonderful podcast, The Simple Show.
 
To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.

 

Jul 27, 2017
Episode 3: Rabbi Evan Moffic (Enneagram 3), Shalom & Success
59:01
Can you pursue a life of success and enjoy a growing sense of 'shalom'--the Hebrew word for a sense of inner harmony, wholeness, and ultimate well-being we all long to experience? Listen into my conversation with Rabbi Evan Moffic, a renowned author, Jewish scholar, and Enneagram Three (AKA The Performer). A high honors graduate of Stanford University and the youngest rabbi of a major Jewish congregation in the United States, Rabbi Moffic loves and uses the Enneagram to support his own journey toward personal transformation and as a tool in his work with others as well. 
 
From beginning to end, this is one of the richest conversations I've ever had about the Enneagram and spiritual transformation. This episode is for everybody, regardless of spiritual background or worldview. If for some reason you're short on time this week please, please, please skip forward to 24:58 and listen through to the end of the show. You won't be disappointed!
 
Rabbi Moffic's book, What Every Christian Needs to Know About the Jewishness of Jesus was a 2015 best-seller, and his upcoming book—The Happiness Prayer: Ancient Jewish Wisdom for the Best Way to Live Today reveals an ancient Jewish prayer whose teachings open the door to happiness and meaning for people of all faiths.

Download a PDF of his Happiness Tracker here

You can connect with Rabbi Evan Moffic at rabbimoffic.com.

To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.
Jul 20, 2017
Episode 2: Bob & Maria Goff, the Beautifully Imperfect Marriage of an Enneagram 9 & 7
53:11
Bob Goff is a 7. His wife, Maria, is a 9. This is an episode about how two very different types can love and compliment each other. We learned a lot about 7’s on last week’s episode with Rob Bell, and while we’ll dig more into the 7 as we talk to Bob, we’re going to get a great understanding of the 9 as Maria joins today’s conversation. 
 
Be sure and check out Bob’s book, Love Does, and Maria’s new book, Love Lives Here.
 
Also, check out Dream Big Framework to learn about Bob’s upcoming workshop.
 
To download a PDF of a chapter from Ian's book called Finding Your Type, visit TypologyPodcast.com. You can follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And if you like the show, we’d love for you to go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. It helps us know what you think, and it helps others find out about the show.
Jul 13, 2017
Episode 1: Rob Bell (Enneagram 7), Author, Speaker & Gracious Provocateur
52:17
When I launched this podcast, I knew Rob Bell had to be my first guest. Discovering the Enneagram was a game-changer for Rob. His knowledge and enthusiasm for the Enneagram runs deep, and as you’ll discover while listening to this episode, Rob is an Enneagram "7 with a 7 wing."
 
Check out Rob’s latest book, What Is the Bible?, and visit RobBell.com for speaking dates and other events.

To keep up with what we’re doing at Typology, visit TypologyPodcast.com, or follow us on TwitterInstagram and Facebook. And don’t forget to subscribe to this podcast and leave us a review!
Jul 06, 2017
Introducing Typology & the Enneagram
06:21
Who are we? Why do we act, think and feel the way we do? How does the lens through which we see the world shape the way we live our lives?
 
Welcome to Typology, a podcast that explores the mystery of the human personality and how we can use the Enneagram typing system as a tool to become our most authentic selves. Hosted by author, speaker, and counselor, Ian Morgan Cron, Typology features interviews with recognized Enneagram teachers, bestselling authors, psychologists, theologians, artists, business leaders, neuroscientists, and others who are using the Enneagram as a path for personal transformation.

Subscribe now - our first episode launches Thursday, July 6th.
Jun 29, 2017