Brought to you by Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life | Mixpanel—Product analytics that everyone can trust, use, and afford | Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs

—

Jeremy Henrickson is Rippling’s SVP of Product, responsible for scaling their product and design team across three continents. Previously, as Chief Product Officer at Coinbase, he oversaw 10x growth of the product and engineering organization and transformed a scrappy startup into a global cryptocurrency platform with tens of millions of users. He began his career at Apple in the 1990s and holds a BS and MS in computer science from Stanford. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• Strategies for sustaining focus and momentum at scale

• The case against MVPs

• The problem with frameworks

• “Compound startups” and how this influences Rippling’s product development process

• Advice for founders wanting to move faster

• Why you don’t understand your product unless you’re “in the weeds”

• Hiring practices at Rippling and how young PMs can build fruitful careers

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/moving-fast-and-navigating-uncertainty-jeremy-henrickson-rippling-coinbase/#transcript

—

Where to find Jeremy Henrickson:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/jeremyhenricks

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremyhenrickson/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jeremy’s background

(03:24) What it was like leading product teams at Coinbase during the crypto boom

(05:25) How Jeremy kept teams focused and the biggest challenges he faced at Coinbase

(07:35) Advice for going through intense periods at work

(08:52) Maintaining velocity at scale

(12:07) An example of small teams with clear missions

(14:29) A model for building products

(18:03) Jeremy’s thoughts on MVPs (minimum viable products)

(22:26) Designing for the most complex use case first

(23:17) What a compound startup is and how it works at Rippling

(27:09) Rippling’s unique culture of fast decision-making

(28:14) Rippling’s leadership values

(32:13) Advice for cultivating fast-decision-making teams

(33:44) How deep-level thinking and working on the ground helped Rippling expand to other countries

(38:42) Why product leaders need to be right

(40:42) How Rippling decided where to expand to first

(42:29) The case for expanding internationally before you think you’re ready

(45:32) Why Jeremy isn’t a huge fan of frameworks

(48:08) The differences between building product at Rippling and Coinbase

(52:49) How Jeremy hires PMs at Rippling

(58:29) Advice for junior PMs

(1:00:19) Lessons from working with a founder who has strong opinions about what the product should be

(1:02:15) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Coinbase: https://www.coinbase.com/

• Ethereum: https://ethereum.org/en/

• Parker Conrad on Twitter: https://twitter.com/parkerconrad

• Rippling: https://www.rippling.com/

• Excellent Advice for Living: Wisdom I Wish I’d Known Earlier: https://www.amazon.com/Excellent-Advice-Living-Wisdom-Earlier/dp/0593654528

• Matt MacInnis on Twitter: https://twitter.com/stanine

• Rippling’s leadership principles: https://www.rippling.com/life

• Airbnb cereal story: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/18/airbnb-ceo-says-he-wooed-first-investors-with-boxes-of-cereal.html

• Guidewire: https://www.guidewire.com/

• Jira: https://www.atlassian.com/software/jira

• Kyle Boston on Twitter: https://twitter.com/KyleB

• Quicksilver (book one of the Baroque Cycle series:) https://www.amazon.com/Quicksilver-Baroque-Cycle-Vol-1/dp/0060593083/r

• Consider Phlebas (book 1 of The Culture series): https://www.amazon.com/Consider-Phlebas-Culture-Iain-Banks/dp/031600538X/

• The Last of Us on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-last-of-us

• The Game on Paramount+: https://www.paramountplus.com/shows/the-game-2021/

• Tenet: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6723592/

• Corsair H60 CPU cooler: https://www.amazon.com/CORSAIR-Hydro-Liquid-Cooler-Radiator/dp/B00A0HZMGA

• Focal Bathys headphones: https://www.amazon.com/Focal-Over-Ear-Bluetooth-Headphones-Cancelation/dp/B0B93YKQT3

• Pandemic: https://www.amazon.com/Z-Man-Games-ZM7101-Pandemic/dp/B00A2HD40E

• Gloomhaven: https://www.amazon.com/Cephalofair-Games-CPH0201-Gloomhaven/dp/B01LZXVN4P

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Microsoft Clarity—See how people actually use your product | Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments

—

Nancy Duarte is the CEO of Duarte Inc. and has helped create over 250,000 presentations for influential business leaders across the globe, including Apple, TED, the World Bank, and Al Gore’s An Inconvenient Truth. She’s also written six best-selling books, and her TED talk has garnered over 3 million views. She regularly contributes to HBR, MIT-Sloan, and Forbes, and her books are essential reading in leading business schools worldwide. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• Why empathy is at the heart of everything Nancy does

• Why you’re presenting more often than you think

• Tactics for creating interesting presentations and telling better stories

• The concept of a “torchbearer leader” and why it’s important

• Strategies for overcoming stage fright and nerves

• Tips for communicating and presenting remotely

• How Nancy landed Apple as a client and what she learned

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/storytelling-with-nancy-duarte-how-to-craft-compelling-presentations-and-tell-a-story-that-sticks/

—

Where to find Nancy Duarte:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/nancyduarte

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nancyduarte/

• Website: https://www.duarte.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Nancy’s background

(03:25) The insane number of presentations Nancy has helped create

(04:52) The most memorable presentation of Nancy’s career, and what it taught her

(07:04) The lasting impact of working with Al Gore

(09:00) How Nancy landed Apple as a client

(11:44) How working with Apple informed future presentations

(16:22) 3 things to remember when creating a deck

(17:33) The importance of empathy

(20:29) Empathy in action

(22:40) Why internal presentations are so high-pressure

(23:09) Signs you’re doing a good job making the audience the hero of the story

(25:38) The structure of great talks

(28:08) Lessons from great historical speeches

(30:02) You’re presenting more often than you think

(32:07) How Nancy uses this story structure in her marriage

(35:00) The framework What is? What could be? What is the ideal bliss?

(36:07) The importance of visuals

(41:12) Slide-making principles (titles, organization, and more)

(45:46) The Minto Pyramid Principle

(48:02) Think and plan before diving into software

(50:00) The Duarte process for crafting presentations

(53:18) How remote work has influenced the way we communicate and present 

(55:46) Strategies for overcoming stage fright and nerves

(1:01:10) The concept of “torchbearer leaders” and why it’s important 

(1:04:54) The surprising truth about informal vs. formal production quality

(1:07:37) Examples of PMs telling great stories

(1:11:49) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Al Gore’s An Inconvenient Truth: https://algore.com/library/an-inconvenient-truth-dvd

• Apple’s Think Different campaign: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sMBhDv4sik

• The Secret Structure of Great Talks (Nancy’s TED talk): https://www.ted.com/talks/nancy_duarte_the_secret_structure_of_great_talks

• The Structure of Great Talks graphic: https://www.google.com/search?q=nancy+duarte+ted+talk+great+story+up+and+down+like+teeth&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi2hoCZmJH_AhVXATQIHb1KC2AQ0pQJegQIBxAB&biw=1512&bih=838&dpr=2#imgrc=5Jei-bDCXe2qQM

• I Have a Dream speech by Martin Luther King Jr.: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP4iY1TtS3s

• The Minto Pyramid Principle: Logic in Writing, Thinking and Problem Solving: https://www.amazon.com/Minto-Pyramid-Principle-Writing-Thinking

• The Minto Pyramid Principle and the SCR Framework, by Lenny: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/minto-pyramid-principle-scr

• Illuminate: Ignite Change Through Speeches, Stories, Ceremonies, and Symbols: https://www.amazon.com/Illuminate-Through-Speeches-Stories-Ceremonies

• Marshall Ganz: https://www.hks.harvard.edu/faculty/marshall-ganz

• Brian Chesky: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianchesky/

• Airbnb’s Snow White storyboards: https://uxdesign.cc/how-airbnb-proved-that-storytelling-is-the-most-important-skill-in-design-15d04ac71039

• The Writer’s Journey: https://www.amazon.com/Writers-Journey-Anniversary-Mythic-Structure

• Business Proposal: https://asianwiki.com/Business_Proposal

• Writer: https://writer.com/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Coda—Meet the evolution of docs | Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs | Eco—Your most rewarding app

—

Andy Raskin helps CEOs align their leadership teams around a strategic narrative—a single story that powers success in sales, marketing, product, fundraising, and recruiting. His clients include Gong, Dropbox, Uber, Salesforce, Square, and IBM. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• What a strategic narrative is, and how to craft one

• How having a strategic narrative can bring alignment to your entire company

• Examples of strategic narratives in action

• Who needs a strategic narrative and who doesn’t

• Why Andy thinks about movements instead of categories

—

Find the transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-power-of-strategic-narrative-andy-raskin/#transcript

—

Where to find Andy Raskin:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andyraskin/

• Website: https://www.andyraskin.com/

• Podcast: https://andyraskin.com/podcast/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Andy’s background

(08:03) What is a strategic narrative?

(10:34) How Salesforce would have pitched the old way

(12:02) Examples of a strategic narrative in action 

(15:23) How one piece of writing skyrocketed Andy’s career

(16:40) The power of writing online

(17:53) Two paths to writing online

(19:27) Naming the old game

(20:59) Naming the stakes 

(23:29) Naming the objective

(25:17) Naming the obstacles

(26:35) Overcoming the obstacles

(26:57) How the strategic narrative parallels the hero’s journey 

(28:25) Telling one story well vs. being a good storyteller

(29:18) The 5-step framework summarized

(31:33) An example of the 5-step framework in action

(36:12) The impact of shifting to the strategic narrative approach 

(39:08) Companies that are nailing their strategic narrative 

(40:36) Why Andy thinks about movements instead of categories

(44:15) Should every company have a strategic narrative?

(46:33) Signs that something is broken in your strategic narrative

(48:53) Steps to get started on your own

(51:36) How to reach Andy

(51:53) Why the second session is the low point in the process

(55:30) Why the CEO needs to be part of the process

(57:40) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Salesforce: https://www.salesforce.com/

• Marc Benioff: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marcbenioff/

• Zuora: https://www.zuora.com/

• The Greatest Sales Deck I’ve Ever Seen: https://medium.com/the-mission/the-greatest-sales-deck-ive-ever-seen-4f4ef3391ba0

• Gong: https://www.gong.io/

• Tien Tzuo: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tientzuo/

• Want a Better Pitch? Master the “Move”: https://medium.com/firm-narrative/want-a-better-pitch-master-the-move-5fbee071ca7f

• Star Wars: https://www.starwars.com/

• The Hero with a Thousand Faces: https://www.amazon.com/Thousand-Faces-Collected-Joseph-Campbell/dp/1577315936

• 360Learning: https://360learning.com/

• Nick Hernandez: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nicoconut/

• Amit Bendov: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amitbendov/

• Drift: https://www.drift.com/

• OneTrust: https://www.onetrust.com/

• “Shitty First Drafts” by Anne Lamott: https://learning.hccs.edu/faculty/pamela.golden/engl2327/shitty-first-drafts-by-anne-lamott/view

• Story: https://www.amazon.com/Story-Substance-Structure-Principles-Screenwriting/

• Out of Sheer Rage: https://www.amazon.com/Out-Sheer-Rage-Wrestling-Lawrence/

• Station Eleven: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10574236/

• Fitbit: https://www.fitbit.com/global/us/home

• Apple Watch: https://www.apple.com/watch

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Microsoft Clarity—See how people actually use your product | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments | Eco—Your most rewarding app

—

Gustav Söderström is the Co-President and Chief Product and Technology Officer at Spotify. He is responsible for Spotify’s global product and technology strategy, overseeing the product, design, data, and engineering teams. Prior to Spotify, he founded 13th Lab, a startup that was later acquired by Facebook’s Oculus. He also served as the Director of Product and Business Development for Yahoo Mobile and founded Kenet Works, a company focused on community software for mobile phones, which was acquired by Yahoo in 2006. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• How Spotify structures product teams to promote freedom of thought

• Lessons on thinking long-term and navigating negative feedback

• Why Gustav started a podcast and what he’s learned

• How AI has impacted the work PMs, engineers, and designers do within Spotify

• AI-generated music and its impact on artists

• What’s next for Spotify and Spotify Podcasting

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/lessons-from-scaling-spotify-the-science-of-product-taking-risky-bets-and-how-ai-is-already-impacting-the-future-of-music-gustav-soderstrom-co-president-cpo-and-cto-at-spotify/#transcript

—

Where to find Gustav Söderström:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/GustavS

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gustavsoderstrom/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Gustav’s background

(04:08) The various roles Gustav has occupied at Spotify

(06:54) Why Gustav launched a podcast and what he learned

(12:37) How PMs and product teams should think about AI

(21:23) AI-generated music

(26:19) Will AI continue to be a magic trick for products?

(28:27) How Spotify organizes product teams

(34:33) How Spotify operationalized autonomy

(35:45) Why Spotify uses a centralized model for structuring their organization

(43:34) The big bet Spotify took with redesigning its interface, and what they learned

(57:26) How they tested their hypothesis before launch

(1:02:35) Gustav’s “10% planning time” methodology 

(1:03:53) How to bring energy and clarity to your work

(1:08:07) How to systematize deep thinking

(1:10:29) The peeing-in-your-pants analogy 

(1:11:38) Thoughts on how the Swedish culture is portrayed in Succession 

(1:13:30) What’s next for Spotify and Spotify Podcasting

(1:15:52) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/

• Daniel Ek: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-ek-1b52093a/

• Spotify: A Product Story podcast: https://open.spotify.com/show/3L9tzrt0CthF6hNkxYIeSB

• Spotify’s AI DJ: https://newsroom.spotify.com/2023-02-22/spotify-debuts-a-new-ai-dj-right-in-your-pocket/

• Avicii: https://avicii.com/

• DALL-E: https://openai.com/product/dall-e-2

• Stable Diffusion: https://stability.ai/

• Midjourney: https://www.midjourney.com/

• Brian Chesky: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianchesky/

• Succession on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/succession

• Fjällräven: https://www.fjallraven.com/us/en-us

• 7 Powers: The Foundations of Business Strategy: https://www.amazon.com/7-Powers-Foundations-Business-Strategy

• Charlie Munger: The Complete Investor: https://www.amazon.com/Charlie-Munger-Tren-Griffin

• The Mystery of the Aleph: Mathematics, the Kabbalah, and the Search for Infinity: https://www.amazon.com/Mystery-Aleph-Mathematics-Kabbalah-Infinity

• Something Deeply Hidden: Quantum Worlds and the Emergence of Spacetime: https://www.amazon.com/Something-Deeply-Hidden

• Helgoland: Making Sense of the Quantum Revolution: https://www.amazon.com/Helgoland-Making-Sense-Quantum-Revolution

• The Beginning of Infinity: Explanations That Transform the World: https://www.amazon.com/The-Beginning-of-Infinity

• The Fabric of Reality: The Science of Parallel Universes—and Its Implications: https://www.amazon.com/The-Fabric-of-Reality

• The Case Against Reality: Why Evolution Hid the Truth from Our Eyes: https://www.amazon.com/The-Case-Against-Reality-audiobook/dp/B07VL5TCVF/ref=sr_1_1

• Gödel’s Proof: https://www.amazon.com/G%C3%B6dels-Proof-Ernest-Nagel

• The Demon in the Machine: How Hidden Webs of Information Are Solving the Mystery of Life: https://www.amazon.com/Demon-Machine-Information-Solving-Mystery

• Halt and Catch Fire on Apple TV: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/halt-and-catch-fire/umc.cmc.5s15r46uj0wx044tipm2zoh88

• Duolingo: https://www.duolingo.com/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Braintrust—For when you needed talent, yesterday | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments | Rows—The spreadsheet where data comes to life

—

Scott Belsky is an entrepreneur, author, investor, and currently Adobe’s Chief Strategy Officer and EVP of Design and Emerging Products. He founded Behance, an online platform for creative professionals to showcase and discover work, and served as CEO until its acquisition by Adobe. Scott is an early advisor and investor in several businesses at the intersection of technology and design, including Pinterest, Uber, Warby Parker, Airtable, and Flexport. He is also the author of two nationally bestselling books and founded 99U, a publication and conference focused on productivity in the creative world. In today’s episode, we discuss:

* How to strengthen your product sense

* Why you should only do half the things you want

* What it takes to build a successful consumer product

* Why you are probably underinvesting in onboarding

* The future of AI and how to prepare for it

* Advice for founders and PMs who are feeling stuck

* Why resourcefulness will take you further than resources

* Adobe’s current priorities and their exciting path ahead

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/lessons-on-building-product-sense-navigating-ai-optimizing-the-first-mile-and-making-it-through-the-messy-middle-scott-belsky-adobe-behance/#transcript

—

Where to find Scott Belsky:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/scottbelsky

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottbelsky/

• Blog: https://www.implications.com/

• Website: www.scottbelsky.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Scott’s background

(04:50) Why Scott shifted roles at Adobe

(08:29) Advice for PMs looking to build product sense

(10:43) The first mile

(13:18) How to develop more empathy

(16:33) How to build consumer products that work

(20:42) Scott’s philosophy that you should “only do half the things you want to do”

(26:15) Scott’s optimism about how the world will look in five years with AI

(29:44) How AI will impact product teams

(32:55) How the PM role will change as a result of AI

(35:09) How Adobe is leveraging AI tools

(36:59) What the term “golden gut” means

(38:15) Advice for PMs to stay ahead of the new AI trends

(41:02) How to start writing more

(41:49) The messy middle

(47:03) What Scott looks for as an angel investor 

(50:16) Why resourcefulness will take you further than resources 

(52:41) Adobe’s current priorities and the path ahead

(54:58) Lightning round 

—

Referenced:

• Adobe: https://www.adobe.com/

• Behance: https://www.behance.net/

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/thinking-beyond-frameworks-casey-winters-pinterest-eventbrite-airbnb-tinder-canva-reddit-grubhub/

• Crafting The First Mile Of Product: https://medium.com/positiveslope/crafting-the-first-mile-of-product-7ed25e8f1027

• Shishir Mehrotra on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-rituals-of-great-teams-shishir-mehrotra-coda-youtube-microsoft/

• Scott’s tweet on only doing half the things you want to do: https://twitter.com/scottbelsky/status/1441469886975279109?s=20

• Matt Mochary on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary-ceo-coach/

• Adobe Firefly: https://www.adobe.com/sensei/generative-ai/firefly

• Howie Liu (CEO at Airtable): https://www.linkedin.com/in/howieliu/

• ChatGPT: https://openai.com/blog/chatgpt

• The Messy Middle: Finding Your Way Through the Hardest and Most Crucial Part of Any Bold Venture by Scott Belsky: https://www.amazon.com/Messy-Middle-Finding-Through-Hardest/dp/0735218072

• Adobe Express: https://www.adobe.com/express

• Build: An Unorthodox Guide to Making Things Worth Making by Tony Fadell: https://www.amazon.com/Build-Unorthodox-Guide-Making-Things/dp/0063046067

• Cosmos: A Spacetime Odyssey on Netflix: https://dvd.netflix.com/Movie/Cosmos-A-Spacetime-Odyssey/80004448

• Vinod Khosla’s prediction: https://futurism.com/80-of-it-jobs-can-be-replaced-by-automation-and-its-exciting

• Queue: https://www.queue.co/

• Tome: https://tome.app/

• Kevin Kelly on The Tim Ferriss Show: https://tim.blog/2014/08/29/kevin-kelly/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Microsoft Clarity—See how people actually use your product | Eco—Your most rewarding app | LMNT—Zero-sugar hydration

—

Ayo Omojola is Chief Product Officer at Carbon Health, one of the fastest-growing and most innovative health tech companies in the world. Previously, he was a PM leader at Cash App, where he co-created the Cash Card and scaled it to a nine-figure revenue line for Square. He’s also an angel investor in companies like Mercury, Modern Treasury, Faire, and many others. In this episode, we discuss:

• How Cash App broke through the noise and became a consumer app success story

• Why small teams are better than big ones

• Hard-won lessons on team building and hiring

• Why it’s “criminal” not to connect people in your network to things that they need

• Why you sometimes shouldn’t listen to experts

• The importance of first-principles thinking

• Advice for health tech founders

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/frameworks-for-product-differentiation-team-building-and-thinking-from-first-principles-ayo-omojola-carbon-health-cash-app/#transcript

—

Where to find Ayo Omojola:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ay_o

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/omojola/

• Blog: https://kunle.app/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Ayo’s background

(04:13) The story of how Ayo used Quora for discoverability 

(06:44) The scale of Cash App 

(07:37) What Cash App did well

(10:12) Lessons from building consumer apps 

(13:08) Why it’s so important to be different

(14:08) What Ayo learned from how Square/Block operates

(16:36) How to succeed at building a startup within a startup

(19:06) How Ayo transitioned from fintech to health tech

(22:51) Why Ayo loves hiring founders 

(28:32) Team-building strategies

(32:12) The importance of going deep and challenging assumptions

(36:58) Why you should always ask questions

(38:45) Lessons in leadership

(41:43) Advice for founders in the health-care space

(44:48) What Carbon Health is

(46:58) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Ayo on Quora: https://www.quora.com/profile/Ayo-Omojola

• Carbon Health: https://carbonhealth.com/

• Cash App: https://cash.app/

• Lob: https://www.lob.com/

• Mailform: https://www.mailform.io/

• Venmo: https://venmo.com/

• PayPal: https://www.paypal.com/us/home

• Apple Cash: https://www.apple.com/apple-cash/

• Square: https://squareup.com/us/en/home/

• Block: https://block.xyz/

• Pinwheel: https://www.pinwheelapi.com/

• The Three-Body Problem: https://www.amazon.com/Three-Body-Problem-Cixin-Liu/dp/0765382032

• Children of Time: https://www.amazon.com/Children-of-Time

• Children of Memory: https://www.amazon.com/Children-Memory-Adrian-Tchaikovsky/

• Children of Ruin: https://www.amazon.com/Children-Ruin-Time-Adrian-Tchaikovsky/

• Stormlight Archive: https://www.amazon.com/Stormlight-Archive-Boxed-Set-Books/

• Fire in the Deep: https://www.amazon.com/Fire-Deep-Robert-J-Miller/

• War of the Worlds on Amazon Prime: https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/amzn1.dv.gti.49a287c2-44ed-4ffc-afa0-fab86dd0d31d

• Succession on HBO Max: https://play.hbomax.com/player/urn:hbo:episode:GWukCJAu0e4uHwwEAAAB5

• No Context Succession on Twitter: https://twitter.com/nocontextroyco

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Braintrust—For when you needed talent, yesterday | AssemblyAI—Production-ready AI models to transcribe and understand speech | Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life

—

Jonathan Becker is the founder and president of Thrive Digital, where he and his team have deployed more than $3.5 billion in paid acquisition budgets for companies like Uber, Asana, Square, Tempur-Pedic, and MasterClass. He spent the first part of his career mastering SEO and is a world expert in DTC, lead generation, demand generation, and user acquisition. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• Signs that your company is a good fit for paid growth

• Strategies for optimizing ad creatives

• The merits of different marketing channels: paid vs. organic search, TikTok and short-form

• Insights on attribution and how to approach it effectively

• How market conditions and AI impact paid growth

• The crazy story of how Jonathan won Uber as a client

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/mastering-paid-growth-jonathan-becker-thrive-digital/#transcript

—

Where to find Jonathan Becker:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/jzbecker

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathanbecker123/

• Website: https://thrivedigital.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jonathan’s background

(07:25) The crazy story of how Jonathan won Uber as a client

(11:56) Interchangeable terms for “paid growth”

(12:31) Why you shouldn’t put all your eggs in one basket

(16:48) What kind of companies should pursue paid growth

(23:07) Is it possible to reach scale exclusively through paid growth?

(27:07) The evolution of performance marketing

(29:39) Advice for founders choosing between SEO and paid

(32:18) Strategies for optimizing ad creatives

(44:43) Paid vs. organic search, TikTok and short-form

(49:56) Where to spend money in order to drive growth for B2B SaaS

(55:06) Attribution in performance marketing 

(1:04:18) The impact of AI on paid growth

(1:12:52) Advice for early-stage startups on hiring in-house vs. hiring an agency 

(1:17:09) Qualifications to look for in your hires

(1:23:23) How Jonathan won Snapchat as a client

(1:28:55) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Andrew Wilkinson: https://www.linkedin.com/in/awilkinson/

• Garrett Camp: https://www.forbes.com/profile/garrett-camp/

• TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/

• Grammarly: https://app.grammarly.com/

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/en

• Supermetrics: https://supermetrics.com/

• Recast: https://getrecast.com/

• Midjourney: https://www.midjourney.com/

• DALL-E: https://openai.com/product/dall-e-2

• Storyworthy: https://www.amazon.com/Storyworthy-Engage-Persuade-through-Storytelling/dp/1608685489

• Shoe Dog: A Memoir by the Creator of Nike: https://www.amazon.com/Shoe-Dog-Memoir-Creator-Nike-ebook/dp/B0176M1A44

• American Kingpin: https://www.amazon.com/American-Kingpin-Criminal-Mastermind-Behind/dp/1591848148

• The Big Short: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1596363/

• White Lotus on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-white-lotus

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Mixpanel—Product analytics that everyone can trust, use, and afford | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments | Braintrust—For when you needed talent, yesterday

—

David Singleton is Chief Technology Officer at Stripe, where he oversees engineering and design teams. Since joining Stripe, David has helped grow the technology org across the U.S. and developed new engineering hubs in Singapore and Dublin as well as Stripe’s fifth hub, remote engineering, across the globe. Before Stripe, he spent 11 years at Google, where he was VP of Engineering, leading product development and coordinating more than 15 different hardware partnerships. In today’s episode, we cover:

• Hiring secrets that set Stripe employees apart

• How to build a product-minded engineering team

• How to operationalize meticulousness

• Strategies for maintaining developer productivity at scale

• The process of “friction logging” used to make better products

• How AI is changing the way engineers work

• Insights for planning and prioritizing at scale

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-a-culture-of-excellence-david-singleton-cto-of-stripe/#transcript

—

Where to find David Singleton:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/dps

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidpsingleton/

• Website: https://blog.singleton.io/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) David’s background

(04:22) How Stripe’s unique hiring process has helped them build an incredible team

(12:27) An example of a relentlessly curious and passionate employee

(14:11) Structured hiring loops at Stripe

(16:39) How Stripe built a product-minded engineering culture

(21:56) Stripe’s operating principles 

(25:39) How Stripe uses “friction logging” to build a meticulous product culture 

(32:22) How to operationalize friction logging

(35:02) How to set PMs up for success

(36:53) Stripe’s collaborative approach to product evaluation

(41:17) Advice for presenting to CTOs 

(42:58) How to get better at building products

(45:28) Stripe’s “engineerications” and the importance of getting into the weeds as a leader

(52:03) Auto-testing and other strategies to improve shipping speeds

(59:29) Improving developer productivity

(1:00:54) How AI has impacted the way Stripe builds product 

(1:07:03) Why David is excited about Copilot

(1:09:24) Lessons from managing people

(1:14:30) Planning and prioritization based on first-principles thinking

(1:18:23) Lenny’s feedback from using Stripe

(1:19:14) What’s next for Stripe

(1:22:10) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Stripe: https://stripe.com/

• Jeff Weinstein: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffwweinstein/

• How we use friction logs to improve products at Stripe: https://dev.to/stripe/how-we-use-friction-logs-to-improve-products-at-stripe-i6p

• GitHub Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilot

• High Output Management by Andrew Grove: https://www.amazon.com/High-Output-Management-Andrew-Grove/dp/0679762884

• Build by Tony Fadell: https://www.amazon.com/Build/dp/1787634116/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0

• Scaling People: Tactics for Management and Company Building by Claire Hughes Johnson: https://www.amazon.com/Scaling-People-Tactics-Management-Building/dp/1953953212/

• Andrej Karpathy on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@AndrejKarpathy

• Midjourney: https://www.midjourney.com/home/

• Emily Sands: https://www.linkedin.com/in/egsands/

• Michelle Bu: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michellebu/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Rows—The spreadsheet where data comes to life | Braintrust—For when you needed talent, yesterday | Coda—Meet the evolution of docs

—

Carilu Dietrich is a former CMO, most notably the Head of Marketing who took Atlassian public. These days she’s an advisor to CEOs and CMOs of hypergrowth B2B companies and has worked with companies like Miro, Segment, Bill.com, 1Password, Productboard, Sprout Social, Weights & Biases, and more. In today’s episode, we discuss:

* Patterns across the most successful hypergrowth companies

* How to advance in your career, and how to someday become an executive

* How to decide which company to work at

* Advice for navigating the job market during tough times

* How to find and execute new growth opportunities

* Why most CMOs and CPOs get fired, and what we can learn from this

—

Find the transcript for this episode and all past episodes at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/episodes/. Today’s transcript will be live by 8 a.m. PT.

—

Where to find Carilu Dietrich:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hypergrowth-advisor/

• Newsletter: www.carilu.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/clu007

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Carilu’s background

(04:28) Habits and behaviors that will help you reach an executive role

(07:15) Why there is no substitute for working hard

(08:15) 5 things you need to do to get to the C-suite

(10:39) Choosing the right company for accelerated career growth

(12:42) Criteria for assessing a phenomenal company

(14:41) Asking better questions and making decisions with energy

(16:05) Advice for finding a job during a recession 

(19:25) The importance of quality products and sustained brand advertising

(24:06) Lessons from successful hypergrowth companies

(28:14) Is word of mouth a necessary growth lever?

(31:31) How to accelerate word-of-mouth marketing

(35:28) Atlassian’s product-led growth strategy and delayed sales team hiring

(39:54) When to hire your first salesperson 

(43:04) Common growth levers and roadblocks 

(47:01) How to build trust between CEOs and CMOs

(49:00) Challenges of C-suite roles in startups

(52:55) Bundling strategies

(57:17) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Tomasz Tunguz: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tomasztunguz/

• Denise Persson: https://www.linkedin.com/in/denisepersson/

• Oracle: https://www.oracle.com/

• Atlassian: https://www.atlassian.com/

• Classy: https://www.classy.org/

• Snowflake: https://www.snowflake.com/en/

• Salesforce: https://www.salesforce.com/

• Okta’s “Businesses at Work” 2023: https://www.okta.com/businesses-at-work/

• Y U No Use Hipchat billboard: https://techcrunch.com/2011/04/22/y-u-no-have-lame-billboard-hipchat/

• Productboard: https://www.productboard.com/

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Scott Farquhar: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottfarquhar/

• Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-product-led-sales-elena-verna/

• Tao Te Ching, Stephen Mitchell translation: https://www.amazon.com/Tao-Te-Ching-Laozi/dp/0060812451/ref=asc_df_0060812451/

• How to Win Friends and Influence People: https://www.amazon.com/How-Win-Friends-Influence-People/dp/8183227899/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0

• Never Split the Difference: https://www.amazon.com/Never-Split-Difference-audiobook/dp/B01COR1GM2/ref=sr_1_1

• Everything Everywhere All At Once on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/movie/everything-everywhere-all-at-once-fa320000-8cf3-46fc-8c45-df5ec67b71f2

• Tara Brach guided meditations: https://www.tarabrach.com/guided-meditations/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Linear—The new standard for modern software development | Braintrust—For when you needed talent, yesterday | Rows—The spreadsheet where data comes to life

—

Elena Verna is a leading growth expert with over 15 years of experience in tech. She was SVP of Growth at SurveyMonkey and interim CMO at Miro, where she built high-performing teams that drove significant growth. She recently served as interim Head of Growth at Amplitude and currently advises and is a board member for early-stage startups. In today’s podcast, we discuss:

• What product-led sales is

• How product-led sales differs from product-led growth

• Unpacking common acronyms: PQAs, PQs, PQLs, and MQLs

• When and how to consider investing in PLS

• Metrics for identifying qualified accounts

• The team, data, and tooling required for implementing PLS

• Common pitfalls to avoid when adding PLS

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-product-led-sales-elena-verna/#transcript

—

Where to find Elena Verna:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elenaverna

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/elenaverna

• Newsletter: https://elenaverna.substack.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Elena’s background and what she’s doing now

(07:13) Product-led sales (PLS) vs. product-led growth (PLG)

(12:47) How sales solutions can be applied to enterprise-level problems

(15:06) Defining enterprise-level problems 

(17:51) How product-led companies start with PLS

(20:30) When to add sales

(22:36) Two ways to get to PLS

(24:27) Why every sales-led-growth company needs to add PLG

(26:50) Two ways you can own revenue

(28:37) PQAs, PQs, PQLs, and MQLs

(37:17) How to get started adding PLS

(42:01) Metrics to identify PQAs

(47:00) Why sales should be carefully applied 

(49:07) Systems, infrastructure, and tooling

(50:59) The people and resources required for PLS

(53:42) Why you should have a clear ROI for every new hire

(55:05) Why product needs to be accountable for monetization with PLS

(59:57) Revenue-based goals product teams should have

(1:06:28) Common pitfalls startups run into when implementing PLS

(1:09:15) Benchmarks and the amount of time needed for implementing enterprise solutions

(1:12:04) Using onboarding to profile users

(1:13:08) Will AI be the next sales movement?

—

Referenced:

• Elena’s previous episode on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Elena’s PLS funnel diagram: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/elenaverna_b2b-product-led-sales-guide-activity-7052664130763206658-yxLK/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_desktop

• Elena’s memes: https://www.elenaverna.com/memes

• Mixpanel Signal reports: https://mixpanel.com/blog/mixpanel-signal-launch/

• Amplitude Compass chart: https://help.amplitude.com/hc/en-us/articles/235147347-The-Compass-chart-discover-your-users-a-ha-moments

• Looker: https://www.looker.com/

• Tableau: https://www.tableau.com/

• Salesforce: https://www.salesforce.com/

• HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/

• Marketo: https://nation.marketo.com/

• Waitlist for PLG course on Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/programs/product-led-growth

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Brought to you by Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life | Braintrust—For when you needed talent, yesterday | Linear—The new standard for modern software development

—

Varun Parmar is the Chief Product Officer of Miro and has over two decades of experience in the tech industry. Prior to joining Miro, Varun held executive positions as Chief Product Officer at Box and Syncplicity (acquired by Dell EMC) and spent six years in product management at Adobe. He also co-founded Doculus, which was later acquired by Box. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• The importance of empathy and how to foster it

• The “AMPED” structure for cross-functional product teams

• How to move fast and stay ahead of the competition

• Powerful product and design rituals

• How Miro acquired their first 1,000 users

• How Miro successfully added a sales motion

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/an-inside-look-at-how-miro-builds-product-lessons-on-outmaneuvering-competitors-team-structure-product-quality-and-moving-fast-varun-parmar-cpo-of-miro/#transcript

—

Where to find Varun Parmar:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/vparmar230

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vparmar/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Varun’s background

(04:08) How Miro operates as a cross-cultural product team

(07:22) How applying empathy helped Miro build Miro Talktrack

(11:51) What makes Miro stand out

(17:08) Miro’s AMPED structure

(22:57) The benefit of having product marketing as a part of the cross-functional team

(25:24) How competition affects growth and product strategy

(31:43) Why speed is so important and how to improve it

(34:21) How Miro ensures that their products meet quality standards

(37:19) How to remove blockers

(47:22) Miro’s product development process

(53:34) How OKRs work at Miro

(55:55) The product stack at Miro

(1:01:20) Big bets vs. maintenance and bug fixes at Miro

(1:03:44) The “three horizons” framework

(1:04:30) The importance of accountability

(1:10:46) How Miro got their first 1,000 users

(1:12:33) Other growth levers at Miro

(1:15:53) Adding a sales motion

(1:18:08) Miro AI, and new updates and enhancements coming soon

(1:20:12) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Miro Talktrack: https://help.miro.com/hc/en-us/articles/7825622973330-Miro-Talktrack-board-recordings-BETA-

• The design sprint: https://www.thesprintbook.com/the-design-sprint

• Jake Knapp on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jake-knapp/

• Miroverse: https://miro.com/miroverse/

• Amp It Up: Leading for Hypergrowth by Raising Expectations, Increasing Urgency, and Elevating Intensity: https://www.amazon.com/Amp-Unlocking-Hypergrowth-Expectations-Intensity/dp/1119836115

• Reinforcement learning: https://towardsdatascience.com/reinforcement-learning-101-e24b50e1d292

• Jira: https://www.atlassian.com/software/jira

• Confluence: https://www.atlassian.com/software/confluence

• Coda: https://coda.io/

• Looker: https://www.looker.com/google-cloud/

• Productboard: https://www.productboard.com/

• Three horizons framework: https://www.mckinsey.com/capabilities/strategy-and-corporate-finance/our-insights/enduring-ideas-the-three-horizons-of-growth

• Capterra: https://www.capterra.com/

• Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

• Barbra Gago on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/category-creation-and-brand-building-barbra-gago-pando-miro-greenhouse-culture-amp/

• FIFA World Cup template: https://miro.com/miroverse/fifa-world-cup-2022-editable-bracket-diagrams/

• When Breath Becomes Air: https://www.amazon.com/When-Breath-Becomes-Paul-Kalanithi/dp/081298840X/

• Hit Refresh: The Quest to Rediscover Microsoft’s Soul and Imagine a Better Future for Everyone: https://www.amazon.com/Hit-Refresh-Rediscover-Microsofts-Everyone/dp/0062652508/

• Ted Lasso on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/ted-lasso/

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Sprig—Product insights that drive product success.

—

Ada Chen Rekhi is an executive coach and co-founder of Notejoy. She helps founders scale themselves alongside their teams. She has over a decade of experience leading teams through periods of rapid transition, from the chaos of founding early-stage startups to leadership roles in growing SurveyMonkey and LinkedIn. In today’s podcast, we discuss:

• How utilizing a “curiosity loop” can aid you in decision-making

• A values exercise that can help determine if your life choices align with your personal values

• Ada’s “explore and exploit” framework for making the most of your job opportunities

• The advantages of seeking an executive coach and useful tips on finding one

• Tips for women navigating working in Silicon Valley

• Why it’s so important to provide constructive feedback

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-make-better-decisions-and-build-a-joyful-career-ada-chen-rekhi-notejoy-linkedin-surveymonkey/#transcript

—

Where to find Ada Chen Rekhi:

• Website: https://www.adachen.com/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/adachen

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adachen/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Ada’s background

(03:17) What a curiosity loop is and when to use one

(11:39) Using curiosity loops in your personal life

(14:13) How curiosity loops are like customer advisory councils

(16:30) A values exercise

(25:30) Ada’s “explore and exploit” framework

(31:28) When it’s time to leave your job

(35:37) Logo collecting and why you should optimize for your values instead

(39:30) What triggered Ada to reevaluate her career path

(42:10) Why most people don’t actually need a coach

(44:59) When coaching is valuable

(47:20) How to find the right coach

(51:38) Advice for women in Silicon Valley

(1:00:08) Eating your vegetables—why you need to power through things you find challenging

(1:05:07) Why you should write to crystallize knowledge, rather than for likes

(1:06:54) How to successfully build a company with your spouse

(1:11:07) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• SurveyMonkey: https://www.surveymonkey.com/

• Values exercise: https://www.adachen.com/build-your-inner-scorecard-a-10-minute-exercise-for-better-decisions/

• Clay: https://www.clay.com/

• The Dip: A Little Book That Teaches You When to Quit (and When to Stick): https://www.amazon.com/Dip-Little-Book-Teaches-Stick/dp/1591841666/

• Research on the coaching industry: https://www.adachen.com/an-in-depth-guide-to-executive-coaching-everything-you-need-to-know-part-1/

• The inner scorecard: https://fs.blog/the-inner-scorecard/

• How to find a coach: https://www.adachen.com/a-practical-guide-how-to-find-an-executive-coach-part-3/

• Radical Candor: https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Candor-Revised-Kim-Scott/dp/1250258405/

• Kim Malone Scott: https://kimmalonescott.com/

• Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion: https://a.co/d/6JycbJo

• Designing Your Life: https://a.co/d/cS2IqG0

• Ted Lasso on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/ted-lasso/

• Star Trek: Strange New Worlds on Paramount+: https://www.paramountplus.com/shows/star-trek-strange-new-worlds/

• Notejoy: https://notejoy.com/

• Captio: https://captio.co/

• Note to Self: https://notetoselfapp.com/

• Arc: https://arc.net/

• Make Time: How to Focus on What Matters Every Day: https://www.amazon.com/Make-Time-Focus-Matters-Every/dp/0525572422

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security | LMNT—Zero-sugar hydration | AssemblyAI—Production-ready AI models to transcribe and understand speech

—

Laura Modi is the CEO and co-founder of Bobbie, the first woman-owned, organic infant formula in the U.S. Previously, Laura spent over five years at Airbnb, where she served as Director of Hospitality. Before that, she spent over four years at Google in finance and operations. In today’s podcast, we discuss:

• Biggest lessons from five years at Airbnb

• Lessons about building great culture

• The power of naivete

• From growth to “slowth”: Why Bobbie prioritized existing customers over growth during the height of the formula shortage

• The importance of momentum above all else

• Finding work-life balance with the right infrastructure, support, and frameworks

• The importance of brand, and how to build a brand

• What it takes to win in DTC

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-build-a-cult-like-brand-laura-modi-bobbie/#transcript

—

Where to find Laura Modi:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laurahughes6/

• Email: Laura@hibobbie.com

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Note: Lenny is a small angel investor in Bobbie.

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Laura’s background

(04:20) What Laura worked on at Airbnb

(06:22) The director of hospitality role

(07:08) How supporting hosts led to growth at Airbnb

(08:28) Lessons from Airbnb around culture and storytelling that impact how Laura runs Bobbie

(09:44) How Laura builds a strong culture at Bobbie 

(11:45) The risk she took in starting her own company

(13:41) Advice on taking risks

(15:10) What is Bobbie

(17:15) The scale of Bobbie

(17:55) The infant formula shortage crisis 

(19:49) How the growth team pivoted to being the “slowth” team

(23:23) Lessons from the crisis

(25:16) Building a brand

(31:12) Branding internally

(33:58) The time the FDA shut Bobbie down over labeling

(36:45) How Laura balances her busy mom life with being a founder

(40:17) The power of naivete 

(44:03) Why Laura hires optimistic doers

(45:56) Growing a DTC company

(47:14) How Bobbie leverages content, community, and commerce

(49:42) Bobbie’s pie chart of growth

(50:43) Emily Oster’s influence 

(52:40) The importance of momentum and how to create it

(54:15) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Bobbie: https://www.hibobbie.com/

• Davos: https://www.weforum.org/events/world-economic-forum-annual-meeting-2023

• MrBeast’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX6OQ3DkcsbYNE6H8uQQuVA

• Josh Miller on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/competing-with-giants-an-inside-look-at-how-the-browser-company-builds-product-josh-miller-ceo/

• Milk Drunk podcast: https://milk-drunk.com/

• Emily Oster on Twitter: https://twitter.com/ProfEmilyOster

• Cribsheet: https://www.amazon.com/Cribsheet/dp/1788164490

• Great by Choice: https://www.amazon.com/Great-Choice-Uncertainty-Thrive-Despite/dp/1847940889

• Metabolical: The Lure and the Lies of Processed Food, Nutrition, and Modern Medicine: https://www.amazon.com/Metabolical-Processed-Nutrition-Modern-Medicine/dp/0063027712/

• Purple Cow: Transform Your Business by Being Remarkable: https://www.amazon.com/Purple-Cow-Transform-Business-Remarkable/dp/014101640X

• Expecting Better: https://www.amazon.com/Expecting-Better-Conventional-Pregnancy-Wrong/dp/0143125702

• Outlive: The Science and Art of Longevity: https://www.amazon.com/Outlive-Longevity-Peter-Attia-MD/dp/0593236599

• Bad Sisters on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/bad-sisters

• NoseFrida the Snotsucker: https://frida.com/products/nosefrida

• Careers at Bobbie: https://www.hibobbie.com/pages/careers

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security | Public—Invest in stocks, treasuries, crypto, and more | LMNT—Zero-sugar hydration

—

Shweta Shrivastava is a Senior Product Leader at Waymo, an autonomous driving technology company backed by Alphabet. Prior to joining Waymo, she was the CPO of Nauto, where she also worked on AI-assisted driver tools. Shweta has worked in product for over 15 years in senior roles at several companies, including Amazon and Cisco. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• How Waymo builds trust with riders

• Product management at Waymo vs software-only products

• The state of self-driving technology

• The importance of being a disruptor and why large companies need to disrupt more

• Underrated product management skills

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/product-lessons-from-waymo-shweta-shrivastava-waymo-amazon-cisco/#transcript

—

Where to find Shweta Shriva

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shshrivastava/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Shweta’s background

(03:47) What Shweta and her team are responsible for at Waymo

(05:30) About the autonomous driving vehicle hardware, software, and simulation tools 

(08:14) Differences in working at Waymo vs. a more traditional software company

(11:02) How Waymo builds trust with riders and the difference between driver assist and fully autonomous

(13:57) An example of how Waymo builds trust with riders

(15:55) The commercial, operational, and system behavior metrics Waymo uses 

(20:38) What are L5 autonomous vehicles and why Shweta thinks L4 vehicles are good enough

(22:53) How to keep investors enthusiastic when it’s a long-term investment

(25:24) Building successful teams and successful products

(26:39) Determining what you’re not building, especially before product-market-fit

(27:49) Why large companies need to disrupt their own models 

(29:33) The most underrated product management skills

(33:07) Tips for getting promoted

(35:19) Where is Waymo and how to try it out

(36:46) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Waymo: https://waymo.com/

• Nauto: https://www.nauto.com/

• Working Backwards: Insights, Stories, and Secrets from Inside Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Working-Backwards-Insights-Stories-Secrets/dp/1250267595

• Crossing the Chasm: Marketing and Selling Disruptive Products to Mainstream Customers: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-3rd-Disruptive-Mainstream/dp/0062292986

• The Innovator's Dilemma: When New Technologies Cause Great Firms to Fail: https://www.amazon.com/Innovators-Dilemma-Technologies-Management-Innovation/dp/1633691780

• Top Gun: Maverick on Amazon Prime: https://www.amazon.com/Top-Gun-Maverick-Tom-Cruise/dp/B0B18G8R9B

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Wealthfront—Make smarter stock investments | Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs | Ahrefs—Improve your website’s SEO for free

—

Nikita Miller is a product leader, angel investor, and advisor. She has built and led product teams at companies ranging from early-stage startups to multinationals, and she is currently SVP of Product Management at The Knot Worldwide. Nikita is passionate about scaling product teams to support high-growth businesses and was a product leader at Trello and Atlassian for five years. In today’s podcast, we cover:

• Lessons from building and growing Trello

• Nikita’s roles and responsibilities framework

• How the PM landscape is changing

• Lessons about managing remote teams

• Tactics for driving urgency within teams

• Why working cross-culturally was such a formative experience

—

Find the transcript and references at: ⁠https://www.lennyspodcast.com/driving-alignment-and-urgency-within-teams-work-life-balance-and-the-changing-pm-landscape-nikita-miller-the-knot-trello/#transcript

—

Where to find Nikita Miller:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/nikitadyer

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nikitadyer/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Nikita’s background

(03:56) How Nikita helped Trello develop enterprise features 

(09:41) Trello vs. Jira

(10:28) Similarities and differences between building for users at The Knot vs. Trello

(15:02) Pro tips for Trello users

(15:41) Nikita’s roles and responsibilities framework

(21:10) Why scrum masters are disappearing and what shifts are happening on teams

(21:56) Why every team should have a data scientist embedded in it

(23:27) The proper cadence for the rules and responsibilities framework, and problems around execution

(25:27) Outcomes and output

(28:34) The importance of urgency, and how to cultivate a sense of urgency

(29:52) How to determine if your team is moving quickly enough

(31:03) Prioritization between big bets and optimizations

(31:29) Questions Nikita asks to understand her team’s speed 

(33:30) Changes in the field of product management

(36:42) Advice for people who want to get into product

(38:40) Why being a PM is hard, and thoughts on work-life balance

(43:03) How to manage remote teams and how to do successful, short, in-person meetups

(47:59) The importance of having overlapping work hours and onboarding in person

(49:09) The advantages of working in different cultures 

(52:58) The question Nikita finds most useful

(55:07) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

—

Disclosure: I am a Wealthfront client and I have received non-cash compensation for the testimonial in this episode.

Brought to you by Amplitude—Build better products | Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life | Ahrefs—Improve your website’s SEO for free

—

Hila Qu is an Executive in Residence at Reforge as well as a renowned growth advisor, angel investor, and published author (her book about growth was named one of the top 10 business books of 2018 in China). Previously, she served as the Director of Growth at GitLab, where she implemented and scaled their PLG motion, and VP of Growth at Acorns, scaling them from 1 million to 5 million users. In today’s episode, we discuss:

• The importance of having both a product-led and a sales-led motion for companies of all sizes

• A step-by-step process for implementing PLG

• Common pitfalls of layering on PLG

• How to audit your existing funnel

• Conversion, activation, and retention tactics

• Structuring your growth organization from day one, and as it scales

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-adding-a-plg-motion-hila-qu-reforge-gitlab/#transcript

—

Where to find Hila Qu:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/HilaQu

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hilaqu/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Hila’s background

(03:26) The outcome of writing guest posts for Lenny’s Newsletter

(05:12) Why companies should have PLG and sales

(07:58) What PLG is and why it’s so popular

(09:41) Zoom, an example of a PLG company

(11:24) Common pitfalls in adding a PLG motion

(16:06) The spectrum of when PLG makes sense

(20:04) What you need to be successful in a product-led growth strategy

(24:52) The first step to adding a PLG motion

(30:11) What GitLab does and how the sales funnel and PLG funnel work there

(34:07) Mapping out the funnel

(35:29) Finding leverage and other next steps

(38:24) What an aha moment is and conducting an audit

(47:30) Activation and conversion 

(52:17) Why you should start with activation, and who is doing it well

(55:24) Retention, the messy part of the funnel

(1:00:34) How Hila made an impact on retention at Acorns

(1:03:03) The two buckets of data 

(1:04:56) Tools for implementing a PLG motion

(1:08:47) The importance of data 

(1:10:20) Tips to get started, and why you need to have good data first

(1:12:10) How to do a data audit

(1:15:04) Building a PLG team

(1:22:40) The core growth squad

(1:27:51) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Hila’s guest post on Lenny’s Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/five-steps-to-starting-your-plg-motion

• Ravi Mehta on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-your-product-strategy-stack-ravi-mehta-tinder-facebook-tripadvisor-outpace/

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• GitLab: https://about.gitlab.com/

• Lauryn Isford on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/mastering-onboarding-lauryn-isford-head-of-growth-at-airtable/

• Acorns: https://signup.acorns.com/

• PostHog: https://posthog.com/

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/

• Pendo: https://go.pendo.io/

• Optimizely: https://www.optimizely.com/

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

• HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/

• Clearbit: https://clearbit.com/

• ZoomInfo: https://www.zoominfo.com/

• Endgame: https://www.endgame.io/

• Pocus: https://www.pocus.com/

• Pace: https://www.paceapp.com/

• Toplyne: https://www.toplyne.io/

• Crystal Widjaja on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-scrappily-hire-for-measure-and-unlock-growth-crystal-widjaja-gojek-and-kumu/

• Redshift: https://aws.amazon.com/redshift/

• The Almanack of Naval Ravikant: A Guide to Wealth and Happiness: https://www.amazon.com/Almanack-Naval-Ravikant-Wealth-Happiness-ebook/dp/B08FF8MTM6

• How Women Rise: https://www.amazon.com/How-Women-Rise-Habits-Holding/dp/1847942253/

• 硅谷增长黑客实战笔记 (Hila’s best-selling book on growth): https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07BZC8L78?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_ND87BRFMB0CMWBEVB747

• The Wandering Earth II: https://wellgousa.com/films/wandering-earth-ii

• The Three-Body Problem: https://www.amazon.com/Three-Body-Problem-Cixin-Liu/dp/0765382032

• Lululemon yoga pants: https://shop.lululemon.com/c/women-pants/yoga/

• ChatGPT: https://chat.openai.com/chat

• Someday: https://www.amazon.com/Someday-Alison-McGhee/dp/1416928111

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Amplitude—Build better products | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments | Ahrefs—Improve your website's SEO for free

—

Casey Winters is a longtime and legendary advisor and operator. He’s worked with companies like Airbnb, Faire, Canva, Whatnot, Thumbtack, Tinder, and Reddit and until recently was the Chief Product Officer at Eventbrite, where he managed the PM, design, research, and growth marketing teams. Before Eventbrite, he led growth and product teams at Pinterest and Grubhub. In today’s episode, we discuss what Casey calls the “zero interest rate phenomenon” product manager and how to avoid becoming one. He provides valuable insights on thinking outside popular frameworks, shipping products efficiently, and avoiding overreliance on user research. We explore the three types of network effects, how to leverage them, and how to break someone else’s network effect. Finally, Casey shares his contrarian approach to interviewing product managers and his thoughts on the future of PM roles with AI.

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/thinking-beyond-frameworks-casey-winters-pinterest-eventbrite-airbnb-tinder-canva-reddit-grubhub/

—

Where to find Casey Winters:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/onecaseman

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caseywinters/

• Blog: https://caseyaccidental.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Casey’s background

(03:36) What Casey is up to

(05:24) Why the CPO position is frequently short-lived

(07:26) What Casey learned in his role as CPO of Eventbrite

(10:15) The “zero interest rate phenomenon” product manager

(12:17) Advice for thinking outside common frameworks

(18:35) When to bring in research

(21:16) What Whatnot does

(21:59) Casey’s approach to interviewing PMs 

(23:29) Red flags in interview responses

(24:27) The future of product management with AI

(27:47) Founder intuition vs. team expertise

(33:33) How to influence founders

(37:17) Adding the delivery driver app at Grubhub

(40:00) Network effects

(43:10) Why Zillow is a sticky product

(44:05) How Grubhub’s network effect got taken over by DoorDash and Uber Eats

(51:47) Don’t underestimate the competition

(54:43) SaaS adding marketplace and vice versa

(01:02:30) Defining marketplaces

(1:03:34) What Substack is nailing

(1:05:43) Tips for B2C subscription startups

(1:13:15) Lightning round

—

Referenced:

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast previously: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within-your-company-casey-winters-eventbrite/

• Whatnot: https://www.whatnot.com/

• The 700-calorie breakfast you should eat if you want to live forever, according to futurist Ray Kurzweil: https://www.businessinsider.com/what-ray-kurzweil-eats-to-live-forever-2016-4

• The Way of the Gun on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/movie/the-way-of-the-gun-0fc9590c-3f85-48ab-96e9-1da1b9695065

• Notion AI: https://www.notion.so/product/ai

• Zapier: https://zapier.com/

• Founder intuition vs. team expertise vs. customer expertise: https://caseyaccidental.com/founder-intuition-team-expertise/

• Erika Warren on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/erika-warren/

• Alyssa Ravasio (Hipcamp) on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alyssa-ravasio-23114717/

• Marketplace supply strategy: comprehensive, exclusive, or curated: https://a16z.com/2021/03/31/marketplace-supply-strategy/

• Nassim Taleb on Twitter: https://twitter.com/nntaleb

• The Innovator’s Dilemma: The Revolutionary Book That Will Change the Way You Do Business: https://www.amazon.com/Innovators-Dilemma-Revolutionary-Change-Business/dp/0062060244

• OpenTable: https://www.opentable.com/

• Booking.com: https://www.booking.com/

• Faire: https://www.faire.com/

• How to increase your retention: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-increase-your-retention-issue

• The Goal: A Process of Ongoing Improvement: https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Process-Ongoing-Improvement/dp/0884271951

• Thinking, Fast and Slow: https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Fast-Slow-Daniel-Kahneman/dp/0374533555/r

• Profit from the Core: A Return to Growth in Turbulent Times: https://www.amazon.com/Profit-Core-Return-Growth-Turbulent/dp/1422131114/

• Party Down on Starz: https://www.starz.com/us/en/series/party-down/2011

• The Last of Us on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-last-of-us

• Station Eleven on HBO Max: https://www.hbomax.com/series/urn:hbo:series:GYZWoOQ6F9cLDCAEAAABP

• Kicking and Screaming on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/70052286

• Raven by Kelela on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/06uhdSmIYrWRkdnAPjcRcT

• Optical Delusion by Orbital on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/2jQbFspnSh7erex6RDKQGJ

• Stakes Is High by De La Soul on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/3jlC2uhYNrhikZXLviEnpu

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Coda—Meet the evolution of docs | Rows—The spreadsheet where data comes to life | Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs.

—

Kevin Aluwi is the co-founder and former CEO of Gojek. With over 2.7 million drivers and over 3 billion orders completed, Gojek is the biggest startup in Indonesia and all of Southeast Asia. In today’s podcast, Kevin shares the story of how Gojek overcame endless obstacles—including being underfunded, being unable to send drivers payment, and the local motorcycle mafia coming after their drivers. We cover the importance of brand, the value of doing the hard things, how to be super-scrappy, and helpful tips on building a tech company outside of Silicon Valley.

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/taxi-mafias-cash-vaults-and-100-mom-growth-the-story-behind-southeast-asias-biggest-startup-kevin-aluwi-gojek/#transcript

Where to find Kevin Aluwi:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/kaluwi

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kaluwi/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Gojek: https://www.gojek.com/en-id/

• WeChat: https://www.wechat.com/

• Sequoia: https://www.sequoiacap.com/

• eFishery: https://efishery.com/en/

• What You Do Is Who You Are: How to Create Your Business Culture: https://www.amazon.com/What-You-Do-Who-Are/dp/0062871331

• How Brands Grow: What Marketers Don’t Know: https://www.amazon.com/How-Brands-Grow-What-Marketers/dp/0195573560/

• The Menu on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/movies/the-menu

• Cyberpunk Edgerunners on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81054853

• Arc: https://arc.net/

• Steam Deck: https://store.steampowered.com/steamdeck

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Kevin’s background

(05:00) How Gojek got started and the current scale

(08:35) Some of the services that Gojek currently offers or has offered

(09:37) Kevin’s thoughts on super-apps

(15:36) The importance of brand

(23:08) How to create branding with consistency across copy and design

(26:53) Challenges Gojek had in the early days that required scrappiness

(33:03) Why Kevin doesn’t believe in moats as a durable solution, and the value of doing hard things

(37:30) How Gojek hired private security to keep their drivers safe

(39:38) The value of founders doing and understanding multiple roles within the company

(44:12) How Kevin’s failed finance career led him to take a bet on building tech in Indonesia

(47:30) Tips on building a tech company outside of Silicon Valley 

(52:09) What the market is like in Indonesia 

(55:42) What’s next for Kevin

(57:41) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by AssemblyAI—Powerful AI models to transcribe and understand speech | Public—Invest in stocks, treasuries, crypto, and more | Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security.

—

Lulu Cheng Meservey was formerly head of comms at Substack (where I host my newsletter and podcast) and is currently the Executive Vice President of Corporate Affairs and Chief Communications Officer at Activision Blizzard. She also writes one of my favorite newsletters, “Flack,” where she shares tactical advice for company comms, PR, and messaging. In today’s episode, we dive deep into the world of PR and comms. We discuss why taking risks is crucial, how to gain attention as an underdog, and why it’s important to have a super-specific audience. Lulu outlines several frameworks I’d never heard of before, including a concentric circles framework for identifying your audience, the cultural erogenous zones, and even a physics-based framework for comms.

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/navigating-comms-and-pr-lulu-cheng-meservey-substack-activision-blizzard/#transcript

Where to find Lulu Cheng Meservey:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lulumeservey

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lulu-cheng-meservey/

• Newsletter: https://www.getflack.com/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• “Binders full of women”: Mitt Romney’s four words that alienated women voters: https://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2012/oct/17/binders-full-of-women-romneys-four-words

• Bill Bishop’s newsletter on Substack: https://www.sinocism.com/

• Hamish McKenzie on Twitter: https://twitter.com/hamishmckenzie

• The Network State: How to Start a New Country: https://www.amazon.com/Network-State-How-Start-Country-ebook/dp/B09VPKZR3G

• How to increase virality: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/increasing-virality

• Ryan Petersen on Twitter: https://twitter.com/typesfast

• Brian Armstrong on Twitter: https://twitter.com/brian_armstrong

• Palmer Luckey on Twitter: https://twitter.com/PalmerLuckey

• Pirate Wires: https://www.piratewires.com/

• NYX: https://www.nyxcosmetics.com/

• Gates of Fire: An Epic Novel of the Battle of Thermopylae: https://www.amazon.com/Gates-Fire-Novel-Battle-Thermopylae/dp/055338368X

• The Last of Us on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-last-of-us

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• Lex: https://lex.page/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Lulu’s background

(04:36) What helps an idea spread

(06:17) Mitt Romney’s “binders full of women”

(07:19) Advice for coming up with contagious phrasing

(08:36) Lulu’s esoteric reference that left her Twitter followers confused

(11:08) The importance of taking risks, and Lulu’s thread on standing for free speech

(12:53) An example of another sticky phrase

(14:40) The cultural erogenous zones framework

(16:08) How Kamala Harris made people care about education

(17:29) How to get attention as the underdog

(20:25) How Substack used the concentric circles framework to spread information

(21:32) Understanding the layers in those concentric circles

(25:44) How to get started figuring out your concentric circles

(27:03) An example of aligning messaging with people’s values 

(28:19) Lulu’s mathematical formula framework for comms for a purpose

(28:54) A physics-based framework for comms

(35:56) How Balaji Srinivasan used the concentric circles approach with his book The Network State

(39:46) The importance of a super-specific audience

(41:12) Reasons your comms are failing

(42:40) Why you should focus on one direct communication channel at first

(46:58) Why not every founder needs to be on Twitter

(48:02) Who LinkedIn works better for

(49:23) Examples of messaging with a human voice and hopping on trends quickly

(51:11) Reasons for direct comms 

(53:52) How to get started setting up a direct channel

(56:09) Why consistent, good content is better than trying to go viral

(59:28) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Writer—Generative AI for the enterprise | Dovetail—Bring your customer into every decision | Linear—The new standard for modern software development

—

Josh Miller is the CEO and co-founder of The Browser Company, where he helped build Arc, my go-to web browser. In today’s episode, we get an inside look at the unique structure and values of The Browser Company and how their company culture has helped them land some of the best talent in tech. Josh shares ways that his company embraces experimentation, including their “optimizing for feelings” approach to building, and explains why extreme transparency is at the forefront of everything they do.

Special invite link to skip the waitlist: https://arc.net/gift/lenny

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/competing-with-giants-an-inside-look-at-how-the-browser-company-builds-product-josh-miller-ceo/#transcript

Where to find Josh Miller:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/joshm

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/josh-miller-b31259106/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Early access to Arc: https://arc.net/gift/lenny

• The Browser Company: https://thebrowser.company/

• Arc: https://arc.net/

• Hursh Agrawal on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hurshagrawal/

• Hacker News: https://news.ycombinator.com/

• Scott Belsky on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottbelsky/

• Notes on Roadtrips: https://thebrowser.company/values/

• Shahed Khan on Twitter: https://twitter.com/_shahedk

• Paper by FiftyThree:  https://www.hellobrio.com/blog/digital-drawing-paper-fiftythree

• Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/

• Peter Vidani on Twitter: https://twitter.com/pter

• The Verge: https://www.theverge.com/

• Ellis Hamburger on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ellishamburger/

• Airbnb’s Snow White project: https://uxdesign.cc/how-airbnb-proved-that-storytelling-is-the-most-important-skill-in-design-15d04ac71039

• General Magic: https://www.generalmagicthemovie.com/

• Linear: https://linear.app/

• Raycast: https://www.raycast.com/

• Cron: https://cron.com/

• Thrive Capital: https://thrivecap.com/

• Tuple: https://tuple.app/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Harold and the Purple Crayon: https://www.amazon.com/Harold-Purple-Crayon-Crockett-Johnson/dp/0062086529

• Seeing Is Forgetting the Name of the Thing One Sees: https://www.amazon.com/Seeing-Forgetting-Name-Thing-Sees/dp/0520256093/

• God Save Texas: A Journey into the Soul of the Lone Star State: https://www.amazon.com/God-Save-Texas-Journey-State/dp/0525520104

• The Last of Us on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-last-of-us

• Adam Curtis documentaries on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLStWlBRkr0N_aYjPmbrrjm_rsstpkUBLc

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Josh’s background

(03:56) Arc and the metrics they use to track growth

(04:42) Arc’s retention numbers

(08:22) Josh’s product-building philosophy and why he believes in optimizing for feelings

(18:57) How The Browser Company’s values create a culture that allows them to ship so quickly

(22:46) The “Notes on Roadtrips” doc about values

(27:48) How Josh is able to hire such amazing talent

(37:29) The good and bad of building in public

(45:16) Some of the odd teams at The Browser Company and why Josh calls it a prototype-driven culture

(46:01) The membership team

(48:07) The storytelling team

(52:00) Why The Browser Company doesn’t have traditional PMs

(54:07) A case for adding PMs

(57:32) The role of data, even in a company that optimizes for feelings

(58:30) Airbnb’s Snow White project

(1:02:14) How impactful moments in Josh’s life influenced values at The Browser Company

(1:03:08) How the film General Magic has inspired Josh

(1:04:32) The value of novel names

(1:06:50) Why The Browser Company’s approach works for Arc

(1:12:47) Why you need to nail latency and why Josh loves Tupl

(1:14:33) The shift to cloud computing and the ultimate vision at The Browser Company

(1:23:15) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life | Dovetail—Bring your customer into every decision | Writer—Generative AI for the enterprise

—

Christina Wodtke is an author, Stanford University professor, and speaker who teaches strategies for building high-performing teams. She’s also the author of Radical Focus, which some consider the de facto guide to OKRs. In today’s episode, we dive into OKRs and how they can be used to help your team achieve better results. Christina shares her expertise on crafting OKRs, how she uses them in her personal life, and common mistakes you should avoid when you sit down to write your own. She discusses effective goal setting and outlines a systematic approach to achieving key results. Finally, Christina gives some specific tips on how to improve your storytelling and drawing skills and explains why it’s smart to set ambitious goals.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-okrs-christina-wodtke-stanford/

Where to find Christina Wodtke:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/cwodtke

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christinawodtke/

• Website: https://eleganthack.com/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• OKR worksheet template: http://eleganthack.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/OKR_Worksheet.pdf

• Yahoo’s peanut butter memo: https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB116379821933826657

• The Five Dysfunctions of a Team: A Leadership Fable: https://www.amazon.com/Five-Dysfunctions-Team-Leadership-Fable/dp/0787960756/

• Radical Focus: Achieving Your Most Important Goals with Objectives and Key Results: https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Focus-Achieving-Important-Objectives/dp/0996006087

• Pencil Me In: https://www.amazon.com/Pencil-Me-Christina-Wodtke-ebook/dp/B075Z8J35G?

• The Back of the Napkin: Solving Problems and Selling Ideas with Pictures: https://www.amazon.com/Back-Napkin-Expanded-Problems-Pictures/dp/1591842697/ref=sr_1_1

• The Minto Pyramid Principle: https://www.barbaraminto.com/

• Lane Shackleton’s guest post on Lenny’s Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-coda-builds-product

• The Product Trio by Teresa Torres: https://www.producttalk.org/2021/05/product-trio/

• Ken Norton’s website: https://www.bringthedonuts.com/about/

• The Fearless Organization: Creating Psychological Safety in the Workplace for Learning, Innovation, and Growth: https://www.amazon.com/Fearless-Organization-Psychological-Workplace-Innovation/dp/1119477247

• The Overstory: https://www.amazon.com/Overstory-Novel-Richard-Powers/dp/039335668X/

• Cloud Atlas: https://www.amazon.com/Cloud-Atlas-Novel-David-Mitchell/dp/0375507256

• Black Panther: Wakanda Forever: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9114286/

• The Team That Managed Itself: A Story of Leadership: https://www.amazon.com/Team-that-Managed-Itself-Leadership-ebook/dp/B07ZG5Y689

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Christina’s background

(04:54) How Christina uses OKRs to manage her personal life

(07:42) The purpose of OKRs

(16:15) Mission, vision, roadmaps, and OKRs

(20:57) How strategy ties in

(22:39) Why OKRs should be kept simple, and the ideal way to express key results

(23:45) The importance of customer satisfaction and why you need a qualitative researcher

(24:58) Common mistakes people make when writing OKRs

(26:14) An example of writing OKRs for an online magazine about interior design

(29:28) The importance of repetition

(33:17) The 5 whys

(36:40) Why you should start OKRs with your best multi-disciplinary team

(38:44) Christina’s book, Radical Focus

(40:26) The importance of storytelling and drawing (even badly!)

(43:21) Tips to become a better storyteller

(44:29) Using the Minto method for storytelling

(46:02) The cadence of OKRs and the importance of celebrations

(51:09) A different kind of approval process to get OKRs done more efficiently

(53:01) Why the focus on learning is more important than grading

(54:29) Why you should set ambitious goals

(57:47) Where to start

(1:00:48) The overemphasis of UX in product management education and the importance of business sense

(1:03:01) Advice for people seeking a career in product management

(1:05:44) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security | Dovetail—Bring your customer into every decision | LMNT—Zero-sugar hydration

—

Aarthi Ramamurthy and Sriram Krishnan are founders, angel investors, and product leaders who host the podcast Aarthi and Sriram’s Good Time Show. They have both held leadership roles at major technology companies including Meta, Twitter, Snap, Microsoft, and Netflix. In today’s episode, we dive into how and why to build your personal brand, how to deal with impostor syndrome, and stories from Aarthi’s time at Clubhouse and Sriram’s time working with Zuck. Aarthi and Sriram share their lessons from past failures, their experience building communities, and their techno-optimism, and Sriram offers his hot take on the Jobs to Be Done framework.

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/hot-takes-and-techno-optimism-from-techs-top-power-couple-sriram-and-aarthi/#transcript

Where to find Sriram Krishnan and Aarthi Ramamurthy:

• Aarthi’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/aarthir

• Sriram’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/sriramk

• Good Time Show Twitter: https://twitter.com/aarthisrirampod

• Good Time Show website: https://www.aarthiandsriram.com/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Naval Ravikant on Twitter: https://twitter.com/naval

• Marc Andreessen on Twitter: https://twitter.com/pmarca

• Clubhouse: https://www.clubhouse.com/

• Eugene Wei’s Status as a Service: https://www.eugenewei.com/blog/2019/2/19/status-as-a-service

• Kylie Jenner on Snapchat: https://www.snapchat.com/add/kyliejenner

• The Rock on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/therock/

• Cristiano Ronaldo on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cristiano

• Charli D’Amelio on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@charlidamelio

• Addison Rae on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@addisonre

• The founder of TikTok’s speech: https://ludlow.notion.site/Alex-Zhu-TikTok-4631f80fdcc4423a845e145e807d8e2b

• Naval’s network tweet: https://twitter.com/naval/status/847134295600746496?lang=en

• Y Combinator: https://www.ycombinator.com/

• How Duolingo reignited user growth: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-duolingo-reignited-user-growth

• Hunter Walk on impostor syndrome: https://hunterwalk.com/2023/03/01/imposter-syndrome-is-definitely-misnamed-might-be-a-condition-of-privilege-has-a-fascinating-history/

• On Reviews: https://boz.com/articles/reviews

• Jobs to Be Done framework: https://jobs-to-be-done.com/jobs-to-be-done-a-framework-for-customer-needs-c883cbf61c90

• First-principles thinking: https://fs.blog/first-principles/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Sriram and Aarthi’s backgrounds

(04:16) How Sriram and Aarthi got Elon Musk on their podcast

(08:47) Reflections on Clubhouse and other social networks

(14:14) Why Aarthi and Sriram are optimistic about tech

(25:53) Why you should put yourself out there and build your personal brand

(27:09) Why you should build a network with authentic relationships, and how to do it

(28:56) Sriram’s curated communities

(31:20) What you need to get right when starting a community

(38:35) Why everyone who wants to should create content

(44:22) Why you shouldn’t try to project expertise when you’re still learning

(47:54) Dealing with impostor syndrome, and why you should lean into your strengths

(54:01) Transitioning to a role of authority

(57:30) What Sriram learned about effective management from Mark Zuckerberg

(1:01:20) The biggest failure Aarthi had, and why you shouldn’t fall for fads

(1:02:08) Sriram’s lesson from building mobile

(1:09:21) Why Sriram hates the Jobs to Be Done framework

(1:18:06) Advice for immigrants

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Public—Invest in stocks, treasuries, crypto, and more | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments | Writer—Generative AI for the enterprise

—

Laura Schaffer is the brand-new VP of Growth at Amplitude. Prior to this role, she spent over 10 years leading product management and growth teams at Twilio, Bandwidth, and Rapid. In today’s episode, we talk about the role of experimentation and data in growth, and Laura shares stories of big wins from her time leading growth teams. She explains how customer insights helped her uplevel her career and how she (surprisingly) thinks about qualitative versus quantitative data. We wrap up our conversation by discussing where the best ideas come from and what you need to know if you’re selling to developers.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/career-frameworks-ab-testing-mistakes-counterintuitive-onboarding-tips-selling-to-developers-laura-schaffer-vp-of-growth-at-amplitude/#transcript

Where to find Laura Schaffer:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lauraschaffer/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

• Bandwidth: https://www.bandwidth.com/

• Twilio: https://ahoy.twilio.com/

• Jeff Lawson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffiel/

• The Surprising Power of Online Experiments: https://hbr.org/2017/09/the-surprising-power-of-online-experiments

• Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/

• Online Experimentation at Microsoft: https://ai.stanford.edu/~ronnyk/ExPThinkWeek2009Public.pdf

• The Simple Path to Wealth: Your Road Map to Financial Independence and a Rich, Free Life: https://www.amazon.com/Simple-Path-Wealth-financial-independence/dp/1533667926

• Atomic Habits: An Easy & Proven Way to Build Good Habits & Break Bad Ones: https://www.amazon.com/Atomic-Habits-Proven-Build-Break/dp/0735211299/

• James Clear on The Tim Ferriss Show: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/648-james-clear-atomic-habits-simple-strategies-for/id863897795?i=1000592431628

• The Great British Baking Show on PBS: https://www.pbs.org/food/shows/great-british-baking-show/

• Hotjar: https://www.hotjar.com/

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Builder: https://www.builder.io/

• ChatGPT: https://chat.openai.com/

• Lenny Bot: https://www.lennybot.com/

• Segment: https://segment.com/

• Senior Growth PM, Monetization, at Amplitude: https://boards.greenhouse.io/amplitude/jobs/6636704002

• Lead Growth PM at Builder: https://boards.greenhouse.io/builder/jobs/4814755004?gh_src=30cfda2d4us

• Growth PM at Rapid: https://jobs.lever.co/rapidapi/8d2611d1-6463-4919-9817-31f61e730831

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Laura’s background

(04:15) How to carve your own career path, and an example from Bandwidth

(05:50) Laura’s career growth framework

(10:18) The value of customer insights

(12:25) The “voice of the customer” report

(16:14) Leaning into your strengths

(18:16) The experiment that shifted the way Laura thinks about friction

(20:20) Questions that improved Twilio’s onboarding and conversion rate

(28:53) Thinking about the psyche of your users

(31:26) The hot dog analogy for burying “scary stuff”

(33:58) Why it’s better to be iterative and why experiments fail

(36:21) Saving money by validating fast

(41:58) Where the best ideas come from

(49:51) Experimentation lessons

(52:54) The amount of time a growth team needs to be successful 

(54:43) The big change at Twilio that led to tens of millions of dollars

(58:41) The need for both PLG and enterprise, and how Amplitude plans to tap into PLG

(1:05:42) What it’s like to serve developers

(1:11:16) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Linear—The new standard for modern software development | Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security. | Dovetail—Bring your customer into every decision.

—

Claire Hughes Johnson is the former COO at Stripe, which she helped scale from a small startup to the legendary company it is today. She also spent close to 10 years at Google, where she filled several executive roles, including VP of Global Online Sales and Director of Sales and Ops for Gmail, YouTube, Google Apps, and AdWords. Claire shares invaluable insights from her upcoming book, Scaling People, on how to successfully build and scale organizations. We talk about the importance of building self-awareness, and Claire gives tons of tactical advice on how to say things that are hard to say, as well as how to improve your internal communications, and so much more.

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/lessons-from-scaling-stripe/#transcript

Where to find Claire Hughes Johnson:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/chughesjohnson

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/claire-hughes-johnson-7058/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Scaling People: Tactics for Management and Company Building: https://www.amazon.com/Scaling-People-Tactics-Management-Building/dp/1953953212

• John Collison on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnbcollison/

• Patrick Collison on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickcollison/

• Discord: https://discord.com/

• Toast: https://pos.toasttab.com/

• High Growth Handbook: Scaling Startups from 10 to 10,000 People: https://www.amazon.com/High-Growth-Handbook-Elad-Gil/dp/1732265100

• Myers-Briggs personality types: https://www.myersbriggs.org/my-mbti-personality-type/mbti-basics/

• Enneagram types: https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/type-descriptions

• Disc assessment: https://www.discprofile.com/what-is-disc

• Conscious Business: How to Build Value through Values: https://www.amazon.com/Conscious-Business-Build-through-Values/dp/1622032020/

• Reid Hoffman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/reidhoffman/

• Eeke de Milliano on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-foster-innovation-and-big-thinking-eeke-de-milliano-retool-stripe/

• Running an effective meeting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIiaFW874q8

• Gokul’s S.P.A.D.E. framework: https://coda.io/@gokulrajaram/gokuls-spade-toolkit

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Claire’s background

(04:47) How writing Scaling People helped Claire crystallize learnings

(07:58) How she got started writing her book

(11:11) Advice that changed the way she operates

(15:18) The lack of job titles at Stripe

(19:01) Scaling your organizational structure

(23:46) What founders need to think about in the early days

(26:38) Personal operating principles

(29:04) How to crystallize your own values to gain self-awareness

(34:29) Advice for saying uncomfortable things

(37:12) Being an explorer, not a lecturer

(43:57) Come back to the operating system

(47:17) Organizational structure using Claire’s house metaphor

(50:50) Why some chaos is normal

(52:45) Founding documents you need

(58:30) The components of a company’s operating system 

(1:01:31) Finding the right cadence

(1:04:48) COOs and which types of businesses need them

(1:11:30) Advice on scaling quickly

(1:13:56) The importance of internal communications

(1:16:03) Running effective meetings

(1:17:17) Advice for aligning and making decisions as a manager

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Linear—The new standard for modern software development. | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments. | Pando—Always-on employee progression.

—

Gustaf Alströmer is a Group Partner at Y Combinator, where he’s worked with over 600 startups in his 6.5 years there. He’s also a fellow Airbnb alumnus and even started the original Airbnb growth team. In today’s podcast, Gustaf discusses common reasons startups fail and how he helps coach founders on avoiding these mistakes. He explains the attributes that the best founders tend to have, and signs that a company has potential. We also cover the growing space of climate tech, for which Gustaf has a huge passion and where he’s already had an incredible impact. He shares some key areas of innovation and investment in climate tech, some notable companies he’s helped fund, and where he sees potential going forward.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/lessons-from-working-with-600-yc-startups-gustaf-alstromer-y-combinator-airbnb/#transcript

Where to find Gustaf Alströmer:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/gustaf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gustafalstromer/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Airbnb tweet: https://twitter.com/gustaf/status/1580330162725347330

• Startups Are an Act of Desperation: https://blog.eladgil.com/p/startups-are-an-act-of-desperation

• The 18 Mistakes That Kill Startups: http://www.paulgraham.com/startupmistakes.html

• Do Things That Don’t Scale: http://paulgraham.com/ds.html

• Marc Andreessen: https://a16z.com/author/marc-andreessen/

• How to Talk to Users: https://youtu.be/z1iF1c8w5Lg

• How to Get Your First Customers: https://youtu.be/hyYCn_kAngI

• Pachama: https://pachama.com/

• Request for Startups: Climate Tech: https://www.ycombinator.com/blog/rfs-climatetech

• Climate Draft: https://www.climatedraft.org/

• Seabound: https://www.seabound.co/

• Fleetzero: https://www.fleetzero.com/

• Unravel Carbon: https://www.unravelcarbon.com/

• CarbonChain: https://www.carbonchain.com/

• Sinai: https://www.sinaitechnologies.com/

• Enode: https://enode.com/

• Statiq: https://www.statiq.in/

• Heart Aerospace: https://heartaerospace.com/

• The 100% Solution: A Plan for Solving Climate Change: https://www.amazon.com/100-Solution-Solving-Climate-Change/dp/1612198384

• Without a Doubt: How to Go from Underrated to Unbeatable: https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1982147903?tag=simonsayscom

• Emily in Paris on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81037371

• Everything Everywhere All at Once on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/titles/3493875/everything-everywhere-all-at-once

• How to Apply and Succeed at Y Combinator, by Dalton Caldwell: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yiOcCPvyNE

• Y Combinator on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/ycombinator

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Gustaf’s background

(04:15) What made Airbnb so special

(07:21) How culture interviews and hiring founders contributed to Airbnb’s success

(10:31) Motivations for starting companies

(13:17) Why Gustaf helps founders understand their motivations

(14:13) Reasons you should not start a company

(16:03) The magic that happens at YC office hours

(20:45) Why founders in coworking spaces should schedule time to talk 

(21:36) Questions Gustaf asks founders

(22:26) Common reasons startups fail

(26:23) Getting over the fear of rejection 

(27:57) The importance of solving for pain points and why you should watch users

(34:21) The value of having a technical co-founder

(37:42) How founders without technical expertise have succeeded

(40:46) Attributes of the most successful founders

(44:57) Why it’s hard to predict success and how YC advises against failures

(46:59) Indications of potential for success

(50:03) Speed vs. quality

(51:11) Confidence vs. humility

(52:48) Execution and tactics vs. strategy

(54:36) Autocratic vs. collaborative-driven founders

(56:27) Why you should focus on product first

(59:03) The economic incentive for investing in climate tech

(1:02:16) The clean-tech bubble of 2008

(1:04:59) Why you don’t need to be super-scientific to work in climate tech

(1:06:51) Areas of climate tech and promising companies

(1:12:27) What’s going well in the climate-change space

(1:16:49) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny | Coda—Meet the evolution of docs: https://coda.io/lenny | Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Annie Pearl is the Chief Product Officer at Calendly. Previously, she was Chief Product Officer at Glassdoor, as well as Director of Product Management at Box. She was named one of the most influential women in Bay Area business by the San Francisco Business Times. In today’s episode, Annie shares three paths into product management and advice on how to get your foot in the door. She also gives us an inside look at how Calendly’s product teams are structured, how they transitioned from solely PLG to adding a sales team and unlocking new growth levers, how they do planning, and much more.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/behind-the-scenes-of-calendlys-rapid-growth-annie-pearl-cpo/#transcript

Where to find Annie Pearl:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anniepearl/

• Email: Annie.Pearl@calendly.com

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• How to send a calendar invite with Calendly: https://calendly.com/blog/how-to-send-a-calendar-invite

• Google’s APM program: https://careers.google.com/programs/apm/

• The 15 Best Associate and Rotational Product Manager Programs: https://medium.com/agileinsider/product-management-digest-apm-3c2631683139

• Playing to Win: How Strategy Really Works: https://www.amazon.com/Playing-Win-Strategy-Really-Works/dp/142218739X/

• Confluence: https://www.atlassian.com/software/confluence

• Aha: https://www.aha.io/

• Airtable: https://www.airtable.com/

• Loom: https://www.loom.com/

• Jira: https://www.atlassian.com/software/jira

• Pendo: https://go.pendo.io/

• Tope Awotona on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bawotona/

• The Skip podcast: https://www.skip.community/

• Skip Community on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/skip-community-for-cpos/

• Nikhyl Singhal on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nikhyl/

• Good to Great: Why Some Companies Make the Leap and Others Don’t: https://www.amazon.com/Good-Great-Some-Companies-Others/dp/0066620996

• Hooked: How to Build Habit-Forming Products: https://www.amazon.com/Hooked-How-Build-Habit-Forming-Products/dp/0241184835/

• 20VC podcast: https://www.thetwentyminutevc.com/

• Sing 2 on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81475311

• Miro: https://miro.com/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Annie’s background

(03:50) How to send a Calendly invite without feeling awkward

(06:04) How to transition to product work from a non-technical career

(09:53) APM programs

(10:52) The characteristics of internal-transfer PMs

(13:26) How Calendly structures product teams 

(14:57) Why Annie hired a Head of Design

(16:58) How Calendly structures product teams

(19:07) OKRs at Calendly

(21:02) Changes made at Calendly to improve execution and shipping

(22:45) The challenges with narrowing Calendly’s customer base and adding sales 

(25:21) Where 70% of new Calendly users come from

(26:17) The transition from PLG to sales

(29:23) How to build a great relationship with your sales team

(31:52) Planning and prioritization at Calendly

(38:14) Strategy documents at Calendly

(39:39) Calendly’s product stack

(40:21) How Calendly got their first 1,000 users 

(43:36) The surprising new growth levers at Calendly

(46:05) Fun traditions

(48:43) “Focus wisely” and other aspects of Calendly’s culture

(52:07) Learnings from Box and Glassdoor

(54:57) The Skip Community

(58:10) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Amplitude—Build better products: https://amplitude.com/ | OneSchema—Import CSV data 10x faster: https://oneschema.co/lenny | Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Upasna Gautam is a product manager at CNN Digital, where she works closely with editorial staff and journalists to build their internal content management system. She is also a longtime meditation coach and a board member of the News Product Alliance. In today’s episode, we delve into how product teams are structured and operate at CNN, how CNN uses OKRs and roadmaps, and the unique challenges and opportunities in designing a digital product for journalists. Upasna also shares a story about her team’s product saving the day during the 2020 elections and gives listeners a free mini lesson on meditation.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/an-inside-look-at-how-cnn-builds-product-upasna-gautam/#transcript

Where to find Upasna Gautam:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/UpasnaGautam

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/upasnagautam/

• Website: https://linktr.ee/upasnagautam

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Insight Timer: https://insighttimer.com/

• News Product Alliance: https://newsproduct.org/

• Mindfulness in Plain English: https://www.amazon.com/Mindfulness-English-Bhante-Henepola-Gunaratana/dp/0861719069

• How to Win Friends & Influence People: https://www.amazon.com/How-Win-Friends-Influence-People/dp/0671027034/

• The New Product Development Game: https://hbr.org/1986/01/the-new-new-product-development-game

• The Mandalorian on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/series/the-mandalorian/3jLIGMDYINqD

• Ted Lasso on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/ted-lasso/umc.cmc.vtoh0mn0xn7t3c643xqonfzy

• Everything Everywhere All at Once on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/titles/3493875/everything-everywhere-all-at-once

• Andor on Disney+: https://disneyplusoriginals.disney.com/show/andor

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Upasna’s background

(03:13) How Upasna’s meditation background helps her thrive in the chaotic world of product at CNN

(08:55) How PMs at CNN build in buffer time and create backup plans when breaking news hits 

(10:26) How the product team works with editorial staff and journalists at CNN

(15:22) The product org structure at CNN Digital 

(19:02) OKRs at CNN

(20:10) How CNN’s product teams do long-term planning

(21:37) Why Upasna involves the tech lead in all product discovery/product review meetings

(23:51) How to boost morale with remote teams

(27:39) Balancing maintenance with building new stuff

(29:21) The time CNN.com went down in 2020 and the new platform saved the day

(31:21) How the product team rehearses breaking news

(34:22) The superpowers Upasna and her team have cultivated

(35:50) Why meditation and honing your communication skills help you excel as a PM

(42:01) How to get started on the path of meditation

(44:39) The work News Product Alliance is doing and how to get involved

(51:54) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny | Amplitude—Build better products: https://amplitude.com/ | Dovetail—Bring your customer into every decision: https://dovetailapp.com/lenny

—

Patrick Campbell is the founder and CEO of ProfitWell, which he bootstrapped and sold for over $200 million. In this special episode, we explore 10 big ideas from Patrick, including tips for hiring employees who align with your company values, creating winning pricing and retention strategies, determining the right time to raise money, and more. Whether you’re just starting out or looking to scale your SaaS business, this must-listen episode offers practical and actionable advice that will help you avoid missteps and think differently.

Find the transcript for this episode and all past episodes at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/10-lessons-on-bootstrapping-a-200m-business-patrick-campbell-profitwell/#transcript

Where to find Patrick Campbell:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/Patticus

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickccampbell/

• Email: pc@patticus.com

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Douglas Atkin on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/doatkin/

• Patrick Campbell’s guest post on Lenny’s Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/saas-pricing-strategy/comments

• ProfitWell: https://www.profitwell.com/

• The Cadence: How to Operate a SaaS Startup: https://medium.com/craft-ventures/the-cadence-how-to-operate-a-saas-startup-436aa8099e8

• Edward Snowden on Twitter: https://twitter.com/Snowden

• The Flywheel: https://www.hubspot.com/flywheel

• High Output Management: https://www.amazon.com/High-Output-Management-Andrew-Grove/dp/0679762884

• Thinking in Bets: Making Smarter Decisions When You Don’t Have All the Facts: https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Bets-Making-Smarter-Decisions/dp/0735216355

• Powerful: https://www.amazon.com/Powerful/dp/1939714206/r

• The West Wing on HBOMax: https://www.hbomax.com/series/urn:hbo:series:GX5nwgQDNJZ6aoQEAAAHJ

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• Descript: https://www.descript.com/

• Coda: https://coda.io/

• KTool: https://ktool.io/

• Tweet Hunter: https://tweethunter.io/

• Apple Watch Ultra: https://www.apple.com/apple-watch-ultra/

• Loom: https://www.loom.com/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Patrick’s background

(05:12) Building a team

(07:38) How ProfitWell handled a conflict using their guiding principle, the most charitable interpretation

(10:41) Why new hires need to fit in with the company culture

(12:19) The bootstrapping vs. funding debate

(13:38) When founders should think about raising funds 

(18:08) When and how companies should make pricing changes to their products or services

(23:46) Strategic retention and tactical retention, and why the latter is often missed 

(28:48) Why people don’t want to pay for a SaaS analytics tool

(29:56) The importance of mission metrics for shipping

(34:42) First-principle thinking, the “5 whys,” and Patrick’s alternative approach

(40:21) The importance of frequent customer research

(43:15) Simple strategies for doing customer research

(46:13) Understanding your competitors

(51:06) Why veterans make great hires 

(54:08) Why local strategies are more effective for some companies

(59:21) Why the middle of the funnel is the biggest opportunity 

(1:04:54) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Amplitude—Build better products: https://amplitude.com/ | Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent | Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Christine Itwaru is a longtime product operations leader at Pendo and more recently has taken on the larger role of Principal Strategist there. Before leading product ops, Christine spent 12 years in product management. In this episode, we delve into the rapidly growing field of product ops and discover how Christine is part of shaping the role industry-wide. She helps us define the role of product operations, what kind of person would be a good fit for the product ops role, when your company would benefit from product ops, and what red flags to look for if you decide to go down this path. 

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/understanding-the-role-of-product-ops-christine-itwaru-pendo/#transcript

Where to find Christine Itwaru:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/christineitwaru

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christineitwaru/

• Website: https://theproductheart.com/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Ben Williams on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/how-snyk-built-a-product-led-growth-juggernaut-ben-williams-vp-of-product-at-snyk/

• Pendo: https://go.pendo.io/

• Marty Cagan on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-nature-of-product-marty-cagan-silicon-valley-product-group/

• Salesforce: https://www.salesforce.com/

• Looker: https://www.looker.com/

• Tray: https://tray.io/

• Zapier: https://zapier.com/

• Zendesk: https://www.zendesk.com/

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within-your-company-casey-winters-eventbrite/

• Inspired: How to Create Tech Products Customers Love: https://www.amazon.com/INSPIRED-Create-Tech-Products-Customers/dp/1119387507/

• Leaders Eat Last: Why Some Teams Pull Together and Others Don’t: https://www.amazon.com/Leaders-Eat-Last-Together-Others/dp/1591848016/

• The Product-Led Organization: Drive Growth by Putting Product at the Center of Your Customer Experience: https://www.amazon.com/Product-Led-Organization-Putting-Customer-Experience/dp/1119660874

• Product Roadmaps Relaunched: How to Set Direction while Embracing Uncertainty: https://www.amazon.com/Product-Roadmaps-Relaunched-Direction-Uncertainty/dp/149197172X/

• The Product Experience podcast: https://www.mindtheproduct.com/the-product-experience/

• Matilda the Musical: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3447590/

• Rise on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/rise/6Yv1uRnw2uAJ

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Seismic: https://seismic.com/

• Gong: https://www.gong.io/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Christine’s background

(02:34) How working with Ben Williams led Christine to Lenny’s Podcast

(05:02) The role of product ops in product management

(07:31) How 2019 became “the summer of product ops”

(11:19) The different ways product ops can assist product teams

(15:50) How Pendo used product ops to bring teams together and share data

(18:15) Where user research fits in 

(22:39) How product ops are being utilized—and not exclusively in B2B companies

(24:47) How to convince a product leader that you need product ops

(27:41) Why customer experience is the core of a PM’s role

(29:47) Who is doing the work of the product ops person before that role is created

(31:37) Christine’s response to Casey Winters’s take on ops teams

(37:40) Signs your company could benefit from a product ops team

(30:56) How a lack of transparency led to Pendo adding product ops

(46:11) The line between product ops and product marketing

(47:30) Who might be a good fit for a product ops role

(53:39) Red flags for product ops roles (that apply to any role) 

(54:08) How product teams are structured at Pendo

(57:18) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Public—Invest in stocks, treasuries, crypto, and more: https://public.com/lenny | Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Lauryn Isford is a product growth leader and practitioner, who most recently led Growth at Airtable, and is about to start something new 🤫. In today’s episode, we get into the many tactics Lauryn has learned about optimizing onboarding flows. Lauryn describes how overhauling Airtable’s onboarding led to a 20% increase in activation rate, the company’s unique segmentation process, and why North Star metrics are so vital. Lauryn also shares her framework for a PLG growth funnel, and how to use a reverse trial to leverage the benefits of both freemium products and trials. If you’re looking to find growth opportunities within your funnel, this episode is for you.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/mastering-onboarding-lauryn-isford-head-of-growth-at-airtable/#transcript

Where to find Lauryn Isford:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/laurynisford

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laurynisford/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Sprint: How to Solve Big Problems and Test New Ideas in Just Five Days: https://www.amazon.com/Sprint-Solve-Problems-Test-Ideas/dp/1442397683

• Blue Bottle coffee: https://bluebottlecoffee.com/

• Airtable: https://www.airtable.com/

• How to determine your activation metric: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-determine-your-activation

• Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

• The Ride of a Lifetime: Lessons Learned from 15 Years as CEO of the Walt Disney Company: https://www.amazon.com/Ride-Lifetime-Lessons-Learned-Company/dp/0399592091/

• Rocket Men: The Daring Odyssey of Apollo 8 and the Astronauts Who Made Man’s First Journey to the Moon: https://www.amazon.com/Rocket-Men-Odyssey-Astronauts-Journey/dp/081298871X

• Fifth & Mission podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fifth-mission/id1457274965

• The White Lotus on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-white-lotus

• Belfast: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt12789558/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Zoelle Egner on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/what-pr-is-and-isnt-good-for-according-to-zoelle-egner-head-of-marketing-and-growth-at-box/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Lauryn’s background

(03:48) Lauryn’s spicy take on experimentation

(06:44) Why doing the right thing for customers should be the ultimate goal

(08:54) How Airtable rolled out Airtable Forms with A/B testing

(11:38) The importance of onboarding

(13:15) Airtable’s onboarding revamp and how it increased activation by 20%

(16:57) How Airtable’s guided onboarding wizard improved the user experience

(18:00) Why reducing reliance on tooltips can be a good idea for complicated products

(20:06) The importance of meeting users where they are

(22:52) How Airtable segmented users by learning styles

(24:10) Airtable’s activation metrics

(27:22) How the week-four multi-user collaboration metric was operationalized

(30:45) Other metrics Airtable used

(34:34) When Airtable changed their North Star metric 

(36:26) How much time to give a North Star metric before pivoting

(38:05) Trials vs. freemium and what a reverse trial is

(42:51) How to have self-serve options when you’re not fully self-serve

(46:04) Onboarding experiences that aren’t very helpful

(47:31) How to help users understand features

(48:42) Why user education is more important than pushing premium features

(50:03) The role of guardrail metrics 

(51:40) Lauryn’s PLG growth funnel framework

(54:26) How Lauryn’s framework helps teams communicate more clearly

(55:57) How Lauryn structured the growth team

(57:53) B2B growth as an emerging space 

(1:00:18) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by OneSchema—Import CSV data 10x faster: https://oneschema.co/lenny | Amplitude—Build better products: https://amplitude.com/ | Coda—Meet the evolution of docs: https://coda.io/lenny

—

Keith Yandell started at DoorDash as Chief Legal Officer and during his tenure has also led the HR, Customer Support, Marketing, and now Corporate Development teams. In today’s episode, we talk about leadership, and how to lead with empathy. We dig into DoorDash’s unique culture and touch on the WeDash program, which requires every employee to complete four deliveries a year in order to better understand the customer experience. Keith shares his “How to Work with Keith” document and discusses the importance of openness in the workplace. He also gives some tips for founders on hiring, engaging with legal, and how to make big decisions when teams are competing for resources.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/leading-with-empathy-keith-yandell-doordash-uber/#transcript

Where to find Keith Yandell:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/kdyandell

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/keith-yandell-2a947432/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Gokul Rajaram on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gokul-rajaram-on-designing-your-product-development-process-when-and-how-to-hire-your-first-pm-a-playbook-for-hiring-leaders-getting-ahead-in-you-career-how-to-get-started-angel-investing-more/

• Ryan Sokol on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-sokol-00b2333/

• Tony Xu on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/xutony/

• About WeDash: https://doordash.news/culture/wedash-doordash-employee-program-how-does-it-work/

•  Range: Why Generalists Triumph in a Specialized World: https://www.amazon.com/Range-Generalists-Triumph-Specialized-World/dp/0735214484

•  How to be successful working with Keith doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/12yTpBZFab6SPAruSpSD6CB_qLOu5L8kpQ4CCmX9pDx4/edit?mode=html

• Kofi Amoo-Gottfried on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kofi-amoo-gottfried-3802bb3/

• Tia Sherringham on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tiasherringham/

• Amp It Up: Leading for Hypergrowth by Raising Expectations, Increasing Urgency, and Elevating Intensity: https://www.amazon.com/Amp-Unlocking-Hypergrowth-Expectations-Intensity/dp/1119836115

• Ted Lasso’s quote on Twitter: https://twitter.com/TedLasso/status/1426932132417576967

• Rajat Shroff on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rajatshroff/

• Micah Moreau on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/micahmoreau/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Keith’s background

(03:41) The time Keith asked a potential hire if he was an a*****e

(06:39) DoorDash culture

(08:40) The WeDash program

(13:16) How Keith was able to lead so many different teams at DoorDash

(16:08) Hiring the best experts and then getting out of their way

(18:21) The “How to Work with Keith” document

(21:52) How and why Keith helps his employees land new jobs

(27:22) How he leverages empathy to unify board members

(29:26) The importance of assigning a decision maker and a time horizon for the decision

(31:15) One-on-ones with Keith, and the T3 B3 framework from Uber

(33:12) How to encourage constructive criticism from employees

(34:49) What it’s like to lead in tough times and why it can actually make your org stronger

(37:42) How creating urgency compounds gains

(39:11) IPO day at DoorDash

(40:20) The characteristics of top founders

(41:33) How the pandemic impacted DoorDash

(44:40) Advice for new parents that is applicable in business 

(45:24) The difficulty of gaining funding

(46:58) Advice for founders struggling with fundraising

(48:02) How Keith developed a strong relationship with the VP of Product and Design

(50:27) Building an effective BD team within a product company

(52:36) How to engage with legal teams

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Amplitude—Build better products: https://amplitude.com/ | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments: https://www.geteppo.com/ | Pando—Always-on employee progression: https://www.pando.com/lenny

—

Marily is a computer scientist and an AI Product Leader currently working for Meta’s reality labs, and previously at Google for 8 years. In 2014 she completed a PhD in Machine Learning. She is also an Executive Fellow at Harvard Business School and she has taught numerous courses, actively teaching AI Product Management on Maven and at Harvard. Marily joins us in today's episode to shed light on the role of AI in product management. She shares her insights on how AI is empowering her work, and why she believes that every Product Manager will be an AI Product Manager in the future. We also discuss why PM’s should learn a bit of coding, where they can learn it, and best practices for working with data scientists. Marily shares some insight into building her AI Product Management course and also why she full-heartedly believes you should also create your own course.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/ai-and-product-management-marily-nika-meta-google/#transcript

Where to find Marily Nika:

• Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/marilynika

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marilynika/

• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/MarilyNikaPM

• Website: https://bio.link/marilynika

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• The Download newsletter: https://www.technologyreview.com/topic/download-newsletter/

• TLDR newsletter: https://tldr.tech/

• ChatGPT: https://chat.openai.com/auth/login

• MidJourney: https://midjourney.com/home/

• Whisper: https://whisper.ai/

• Machine Learning Specialization course: https://www.coursera.org/specializations/machine-learning-introduction

• Career Foundry: https://careerfoundry.com/

• Coding Dojo: https://www.codingdojo.com/

• Building AI Products—For Current & Aspiring Product Managers course on Maven: https://maven.com/marily-nika/technical-product-management

• arXiv: https://arxiv.org/

• Marginal Revolution blog: https://marginalrevolution.com/

• Automl: https://cloud.google.com/automl

• Inspired: How to Create Tech Products Customers Love: https://www.amazon.com/INSPIRED-Create-Tech-Products-Customers/dp/1119387507

• You Look Like a Thing and I Love You: How Artificial Intelligence Works and Why It’s Making the World a Weirder Place: https://www.amazon.com/You-Look-Like-Thing-Love/dp/0316525227

• The Adventures of Women in Tech Workbook: A Life-Tested Guide to Building Your Career: https://www.amazon.com/Adventures-Women-Tech-Workbook/dp/1646871022

• Boz to the Future podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/boz-to-the-future/id1574002430

• The White Lotus on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-white-lotus

• Lensa: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/lensa-ai-photo-video-editor/id1436732536

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Marily’s background

(03:20) How Marily stays informed about the latest developments in AI

(04:46) What is overhyped and underhyped in AI right now

(05:59) How Marily uses ChatGPT for work

(08:25) Why product managers will be AI product managers in the future

(11:16) How to get started using AI

(14:12) When not to use AI

(15:47) How much data do you need for AI to work properly?

(17:01) When should companies develop their own AI tools?

(18:35) What an AI model is and how it is trained

(21:25) How Google demonstrated the ability of AI to translate a conversation in real time

(23:02) Why AI will not replace PMs

(23:48) A case for learning to code

(26:21) Where to learn to code

(27:40) How to become a strong AI PM

(29:25) Challenges that AI PMs face

(31:16) Getting leadership on board with investing in AI

(33:10) How PMs will work with data scientists and AI

(35:29) Marily’s AI course

(39:12) AutoML and how a renewable-energy company used it to improve its turbine maintenance procedure

(40:31) How Marily built her course and the modifications she has made

(42:53) Why you should create your own course

(44:08) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny | Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod | Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Eeke de Milliano is the Head of Product at Retool and a former product lead at Stripe. In this episode, we discuss how any team can become an innovation machine. We talk about how a culture of writing led to a team of rigorous thinkers at Stripe. We cover tactics to breed innovative teams that you can replicate at your own company: From embracing retrospectives to creating systems that give individuals the "permission to think big". Eeke shares her framework for prioritizing resources between core products, strategic initiatives, and big bets, and how it helped Retool launch three new products in a year. She also gives a comprehensive overview of the right level of process for companies of different sizes, and how to build a talent portfolio.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-foster-innovation-and-big-thinking-eeke-de-milliano-retool-stripe/#transcript.

Where to find Eeke de Milliano:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/eekedm

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eeke-de-milliano-3b05a629/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Snir Kodesh on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/snirkodesh/

• Stripe: https://stripe.com/

• Stripe’s operating principles: https://stripe.com/jobs/culture

• Retool: https://retool.com/

• Brian Krausz on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bkrausz/

• Retool Workflows: https://retool.com/products/workflows/

• Retool Mobile: https://retool.com/products/mobile

• Retool Database: https://retool.com/products/database

• Ian Leslie on “Being Human in the Age of AI”: https://www.econtalk.org/ian-leslie-on-being-human-in-the-age-of-ai/

• Claire Hughes Johnson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/claire-hughes-johnson-7058/

• Scaling People: Tactics for Management and Company Building: https://www.amazon.com/Scaling-People-Tactics-Management-Building/dp/1953953212

• Linear: https://linear.app/

• Bird by Bird: Some Instructions on Writing and Life: https://www.amazon.com/Bird-Some-Instructions-Writing-Life/dp/0385480016/

• Lex Fridman Podcast: https://lexfridman.com/podcast/

• EconTalk: https://www.econlib.org/econtalk/

• The White Lotus on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-white-lotus

• Gong: https://www.gong.io/product-demo/

• FullStory: https://www.fullstory.com/

• Rewind: https://www.rewind.ai/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Eeke’s background

(03:36) Eeke’s time at Stripe

(08:58) Why Stripe didn’t add PMs until hitting around 100 employees

(11:03) Why being a PM is not for everyone

(12:22) Stripe’s internal culture guide

(17:36) Stripe’s operating principles 

(20:52) Why isn’t every team innovative?

(23:21) Retool’s “crazy ideas” list 

(27:27) How to cultivate a failure-safe space 

(28:47) Fostering risk-taking and innovation

(32:03) The three products Retool launched this year

(35:06) How Retool was able to launch several products at once

(38:00) The amount of process needed through different stages of growth

(45:37) Why you should build products for your “best users”

(47:34) Build the scooter, not the axle (why you should make something simple but functional first)

(48:37) The 70-20-10 framework for investing resources and time

(49:57) Finding time for maintenance and bug fixes

(50:59) How Retool’s PMs keep close to customers

(53:29) Building product in a sales-led org vs. product-led growth 

(56:10) The product talent portfolio: how to build diverse, balanced teams

(58:43) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by OneSchema—import CSV data 10x faster: https://oneschema.co/lenny; Pando—always-on employee progression: https://www.pando.com/lenny; and Lenny’s Job Board—hire the best product people, find the best product gigs: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent.

—

Zoelle Egner is best known for her time at Airtable (currently valued at $11 billion), where she was the 11th employee and built and led the initial marketing and customer success teams. Currently she’s the Head of Marketing and Growth at Block Party, a company that designs consumer tools for online safety and anti-harassment. In today’s episode, we explore the marketing strategies that helped Airtable punch above its weight and build an established brand. We also dig into how Airtable was able to find its first super-users, how customer success played a key role in getting early traction, and the do’s and don’ts for marketing investments. Zoelle also shares her experience working for VaccinateCA (which ended up playing a massive role in helping get people vaccinated during the pandemic) and several tips for obtaining valuable customer feedback.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/lessons-from-airtables-unconventional-growth-strategy-zoelle-egner/#transcript

Where to find Zoelle Egner:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/zoelle

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zoelleegner/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Patrick McKenzie on Twitter: https://twitter.com/patio11

• The Last of Us on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-last-of-us

• Airtable: https://www.airtable.com/

• Hacker News: https://news.ycombinator.com/

• Block Party app: https://www.blockpartyapp.com/

• Kathy Sierra’s book Badass: Making Users Awesome: https://www.amazon.com/Badass-Making-Awesome-Kathy-Sierra/dp/1491919019

• Gainsight: https://www.gainsight.com/

• Datadog: https://www.datadoghq.com/

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• Zapier: https://zapier.com/

• Computing Taste: Algorithms and the Makers of Music Recommendation: https://www.amazon.com/Computing-Taste-Algorithms-Makers-Recommendation/dp/0226822974

• Ancillary Justice: https://www.amazon.com/Ancillary-Justice-Imperial-Radch-Leckie/dp/031624662X/

• The Happiness Lab podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-happiness-lab-with-dr-laurie-santos/id1474245040

• Gastropod podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/gastropod/id918896288

• Everything Everywhere All at Once on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/titles/3493875/everything-everywhere-all-at-once

• Extraordinary Attorney Woo on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81518991

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Webflow: https://webflow.com/

• Clay: https://www.clay.com/

• MKT1 Newsletter: https://newsletter.mkt1.co/

• Emily Kramer on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-build-a-powerful-marketing-machine-emily-kramer-asana-carta-mkt1/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) How VaccinateCA helped bridge a gap in infrastructure

(05:00) Zoelle’s lessons from her time at VaccinateCA

(18:04) How Zoelle broke into the tech industry

(19:01) Flocking patterns

(24:21) What Block Party does

(24:32) Zoelle’s storytelling

(29:15) Tactics for punching above your weight as a small startup

(31:30) The importance of having a highly detail-oriented person on staff

(33:33) Why Airtable used billboards

(36:43) Growth and marketing strategies at Airtable

(42:29) Using data provided by your customers to build features that help future customers

(50:59) Why customer success and marketing should be one team

(52:56) Things to avoid in marketing

(58:04) The power of templates

(1:00:58) Why Airtable did not prioritize templates for top-of-funnel revenue 

(1:02:04) Why just getting PR to “get PR” is not a good strategy

(1:04:57) The importance of getting customer feedback and investing in customer success

(1:05:51) Simple strategies for getting customer feedback

(1:07:53) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Brought to you by Pando—Always on employee progression (https://www.pando.com/lenny), Notion—One workspace. Every team (https://www.notion.com/lennyspod), and Lemon.io—A marketplace of vetted software developers (https://lemon.io/lenny).

Vijay Iyengar is Head of Product at Mixpanel, and similar to myself, came from an engineering background before transitioning to product. In today’s episode, he explains how Mixpanel has evolved its growth strategy from a fast-paced, feature-focused approach to a more deliberate approach that prioritizes design and user experience. He also shares how Mixpanel irons out customer problems, including implementing internal tools that allow engineering and product teams to respond to customer feedback directly. Additionally, Vijay shares his top SaaS products, books, frameworks, and more. Tune in to gain valuable insights from a seasoned product leader.

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/an-inside-look-at-mixpanels-product-journey-vijay-iyengar-head-of-product/#transcript

Where to find Vijay Iyengar:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/vijayiyengar

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vijay4/

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

Referenced:

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• “Shape Up: Stop Running in Circles and Ship Work That Matters”: https://basecamp.com/shapeup

• The RICE prioritization framework: https://www.productplan.com/glossary/rice-scoring-model/

• BigQuery: https://cloud.google.com/bigquery

• Census: https://www.getcensus.com/

• Zoom: https://zoom.us/

• FigJam: https://www.figma.com/figjam/

• A Data Stack for PLG teams: https://mixpanel.com/blog/data-analytics-product-led-growth/

• Product analytics in the modern data stack: https://mixpanel.com/blog/mixpanel-partners-with-census-to-bring-product-analytics-to-the-modern-data-stack/

• Snowflake: https://www.snowflake.com/en/

• Amazon Redshift: https://www.amazonaws.cn/en/redshift/

• Event-Based Analytics: https://developer.mixpanel.com/docs/under-the-hood

• The Goal: A Process of Ongoing Improvement: https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Process-Ongoing-Improvement/dp/0884271951

• Cool Gray City of Love: 49 Views of San Francisco: https://www.amazon.com/Cool-Gray-City-Love-Francisco/dp/1608199606

• The West Wing Weekly podcast: http://thewestwingweekly.com/

• WeCrashed on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/wecrashed/

• Severance on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/severance/

• Gibson Biddle on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gibson-biddle-on-his-dhm-product-strategy-framework-gem-roadmap-prioritization-framework-5-netflix-strategy-mini-case-studies-building-a-personal-board-of-directors-and-much-more/

• Shishir Mehrotra on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-rituals-of-great-teams-shishir-mehrotra-coda-youtube-microsoft/

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Vijay’s background

(04:07) How Vijay learned to be more open-minded to new ideas 

(06:26) Mixpanel’s journey

(12:40) When to optimize for speed

(13:49) The feature phase vs. the design phase

(17:02) The importance of not losing focus on your core product

(19:52) How Mixpanel organizes teams around buckets of problems

(20:43) Mixpanel’s most recent six-month time horizon planning cycle

(25:08) The RICE framework for prioritization (and when to ignore the C and E)

(26:31) The problem with estimations, and why Basecamp suggests using a six-week time box

(30:04) How Mixpanel keeps product teams and engineers connected to customers via Slack 

(33:21) SaaS tools Mixpanel’s teams use

(34:54) The biggest product analytics mistakes

(37:34) The present and future of analytics 

(41:05) How adopting a product mindset has helped Vijay grow his career

(41:47) Lightning round

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ravi was previously CPO at Tinder, Product Director at Facebook, and VP of Product at Tripadvisor. Currently, he’s co-founder and CEO of Outpace, a coaching platform designed to help people reach their professional goals. In today’s podcast, we dive deep into Ravi’s product strategy stack framework and how it was used to develop a powerful strategy at Tinder. We also cover his other popular frameworks—the frontier of understanding and exponential feedback—and how both of them can help you grow in your career. We discuss the differences between building product at a startup versus a large tech company, and how Ravi has had to shift his mindset as he’s moved away from a product leadership role into a founder role. Finally, he shares a bit about how Outpace is using AI to amplify coaches and help make them more efficient and effective.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-your-product-strategy-stack-ravi-mehta-tinder-facebook-tripadvisor-outpace/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Merge—A single API to add hundreds of integrations into your app: http://merge.dev/lenny

• OneSchema—Import CSV data 10x faster: https://oneschema.co/lenny

• Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny

—

Where to find Ravi Mehta:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ravi_mehta

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ravimehta/

• Website: https://www.ravi-mehta.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

Disclaimer: Lenny is an angel investor in Ravi’s company, Outpace

• Reforge’s Product Strategy Program created by Casey Winters and Fareed Mosavat: https://www.reforge.com/programs/product-strategy

• Matt Mochary on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary/

• Indie Hackers: https://www.indiehackers.com/

• Everything Marketplaces: https://www.everythingmarketplaces.com/

• The Product Strategy Stack: https://www.ravi-mehta.com/product-strategy-stack/

• Balsamiq: https://balsamiq.com/

• Set better goals with NCTs, not OKRs: https://www.reforge.com/blog/set-better-goals-with-ncts-not-okrs

• Ravi’s product manager’s competencies framework: https://www.ravi-mehta.com/product-manager-roles/

• Hooked: How to Build Habit-Forming Products: https://www.amazon.com/Hooked-How-Build-Habit-Forming-Products/dp/0241184835/

• Working Backwards: Insights, Stories, and Secrets from Inside Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Working-Backwards-Insights-Stories-Secrets/dp/1250267595

• Ian McAllister on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/what-it-takes-to-become-a-top-1-pm-ian-mcallister-uber-amazon-airbnb/

• The Ezra Klein Show podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/id1548604447

• Ezra Klein’s AI episode: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/a-skeptical-take-on-the-a-i-revolution/id1548604447?i=1000592835492

• Andor on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/series/star-wars-andor/3xsQKWG00GL5

• Airtable: https://www.airtable.com/

• Superhuman: https://superhuman.com/

• Descript: https://www.descript.com/

•  Outpace: https://www.outpace.co

•  Unlock Your Product Manager Potential: https://www.outpace.co/guides/unlock-your-product-manager-potential

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Ravi’s background

(04:24) Why Ravi left Tinder, and what he’s been up to recently 

(08:05) Differences between working at an established tech company vs. a startup 

(12:45) Why founders should network with “early-stage” folks

(14:29) Why you need to do some research and relationship-building before starting your company

(17:49) What the product strategy stack is and how to use it

(22:08) Mission vs. vision

(23:37) How Ravi developed his strategy framework at Tripadvisor 

(26:43) Why PMs should understand design, UX, and UI

(28:20) Examples of the product strategy stack in action

(32:42) Why Tinder resisted adding filters 

(34:10) Monetization features at Tinder and the “whales” who spend the most

(38:18) How customer feedback led to new features at Tinder

(42:28) Why goals come after roadmap in Ravi’s framework

(44:30) Tripadvisor’s strategy for increasing bookings

(47:25) How to set goals that drive outcomes

(50:24) The four buckets of the frontier of understanding

(51:38) Different methods for trying to hit goals

(53:08) Understanding why you hit or missed your goal

(54:34) The product management competencies framework

(1:02:08) The exponential feedback framework

(1:04:25) Why you should ask for feedback—and graciously accept it

(1:06:05) How to determine the right amount of leadership your team needs

(1:09:40) What selective micro-management is

(1:12:25) How Outpace uses AI to assist in coaching

(1:15:24) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

John Cutler writes the popular and beloved product newsletter The Beautiful Mess. For many years, he was a Product Evangelist at Amplitude, which led him to meeting and working with a large number of product teams around the world. Through this role, he gained unique insight into how the best product teams operate. In today’s episode, John reflects on leaving his role at Amplitude, and explains the attributes that the top 1% of product teams share. We also go deep into some of his favorite frameworks and discuss the best way to apply these frameworks to your work. We also unpack skills like product sense and product mindset, and what he’s planning in his new role at Toast.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/what-differentiates-the-highest-performing-product-teams-john-cutler-amplitude-the-beautiful-mess/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Merge—A single API to add hundreds of integrations into your app: http://merge.dev/lenny

• Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments: https://www.geteppo.com/

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Where to find John Cutler:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/johncutlefish

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnpcutler/

• Newsletter: https://cutlefish.substack.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• The North Star Playbook: https://info.amplitude.com/north-star-playbook

• Craig Daniel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/craigmdaniel/

• Working Backwards: Insights, Stories, and Secrets from Inside Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Working-Backwards-Insights-Stories-Secrets/dp/1250267595

• AppFolio: https://www.appfolio.com/

• High Leverage Product Evangelism: https://cutlefish.substack.com/p/high-leverage-product-evangelism

• Satya Nadella on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/satyanadella/

• The Culture Map: Breaking Through the Invisible Boundaries of Global Business: https://www.amazon.com/Culture-Map-Breaking-Invisible-Boundaries/dp/1610392507

• Innovation Labs: https://innovationlabs.com/

• BEES: https://mybeesapp.com/

• Marty Cagan on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-nature-of-product-marty-cagan#details

• Sooner Safer Happier: Antipatterns and Patterns for Business Agility: https://www.amazon.com/Sooner-Safer-Happier-Patterns-Antipatterns/dp/1942788916

• Teresa Torres on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/teresatorres/

• Andrew Huberman on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/hubermanlab/?hl=en

• TBM 49/52: Pyramid of Leadership Self/Other Awareness: https://cutlefish.substack.com/p/tbm-4952-pyramid-of-leadership-selfother

• ChatGPT: https://chat.openai.com/chat

• How to Measure Anything: Finding the Value of Intangibles in Business: https://www.amazon.com/How-Measure-Anything-Intangibles-Business-ebook/dp/B00INUYS2U

• Accelerate: The Science of Lean Software and DevOps: Building and Scaling High Performing Technology Organizations: https://www.amazon.com/Accelerate-Software-Performing-Technology-Organizations/dp/1942788339

• User Story Mapping: Discover the Whole Story, Build the Right Product: https://www.amazon.com/User-Story-Mapping-Discover-Product/dp/B08TZGKKF2

• Build with Maggie Crowley podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/build-with-maggie-crowley/id1445050691

• One Knight in Product podcast: https://www.oneknightinproduct.com/index.html#page-top

• Sunny Bunnies on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81286920

• Booba on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81011059

• Toast: https://pos.toasttab.com/

• Drift: https://www.drift.com/

John’s list of high-performing people worth following:

• Dr. Cat Hicks (@grimalkina) https://www.linkedin.com/in/drcathicks/ 

• Stephanie Leue https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephanie-leue/

• Amy Edmondson (@AmyCEdmondson) https://www.linkedin.com/in/amedmondson/

• Dominica DeGrandis (@dominicad) https://www.linkedin.com/in/dominicadeg/

• Courtney Kissler https://www.linkedin.com/in/courtney-kissler-0930681/

• Christina Wodtke (@cwodtke) https://www.linkedin.com/in/christinawodtke/

• Matthew Skelton https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewskelton/

• Heidi Helfand (@heidihelfand): https://www.linkedin.com/in/heidihelfand/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) What is a product evangelist? John’s unique role at Amplitude

(05:50) John’s reflections and feelings on leaving Amplitude

(17:28) What John’s doing next

(18:52) John’s newsletter: The Beautiful Mess

(27:49) What do the top 1% of product teams have in common?

(40:08) Different ways companies are successful, and why anyone can improve

(45:55) Investing in people vs. investing in processes

(48:49) The importance of culture and values

(49:59) Global company cultures: the individualist vs. the collectivist  

(55:55) Why it’s hard to make changes in large companies

(58:49) How to view frameworks

(1:01:02) The spectrum of performance in big and small companies

(1:05:27) Examples of high-performing people who work outside of Silicon Valley

(1:09:02) The skill of product management

(1:11:35) The value of learning a bit about everything

(1:13:46) Why do people often underestimate the loops available at their company

(1:16:20) Chronic vs. acute issues at companies

(1:18:07) Unpacking the skills behind product sense and product mindset

(1:20:44) A place for people without the traditional meritocracy mindset

(1:22:38) John’s writing process and what he plans on writing about next

(1:27:52) How to use ChatGPT for learning and levity

(1:31:56) Lightning Round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Naomi Ionita is a Partner at the venture capital firm, Menlo Ventures. She started her career in engineering in 2002, shifted to product in 2006, and built product growth and monetization teams starting over a decade ago as one of the first PLG leaders in B2B. She was an early mentor at Reforge and her expertise is in building full-stack growth teams and cultures, launching new products, and helping existing products monetize and retain their users. Consider today’s episode a master class on monetization and pricing. We talk about common mistakes made by founders, specific experiments for how to determine pricing, and why initial growth sometimes comes at the expense of revenue. Naomi also introduces the concept of the Modern Growth Stack, how AI will play a role in growth, and what she’s most excited about for the future.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-price-your-product-naomi-ionita-menlo-ventures/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Miro—A collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Where to find Naomi:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/npilosof

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/naomipilosofionita/

• Website: https://www.menlovc.com/naomi-pilosof-ionita

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

Disclaimer: Lenny is an angel investor in a few startups mentioned in this episode: Eppo, Endgame, Pocus

• Evernote: https://evernote.com/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• The Van Westendorp pricing model: https://www.forbes.com/sites/rebeccasadwick/2020/06/22/how-to-price-products/?sh=7e6077f855c7

• OpenView: https://openviewpartners.com/

• SaaS business model at Profitwell: https://www.profitwell.com/recur/all/saas-business-model

• Envoy: https://envoy.com/

• Invoice2go: https://invoice.2go.com/

• Gas: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/gas/id1641791746

• Endgame: https://www.endgame.io/

• Pocus: https://www.pocus.com/

• Optimizely: https://www.optimizely.com/

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Chargebee: https://www.chargebee.com/

• Zuora: https://www.zuora.com/

• Metronome: https://metronome.com/

• Orb: https://www.withorb.com/

• Monetizing Innovation: How Smart Companies Design the Product Around the Price: https://www.amazon.com/Monetizing-Innovation-Companies-Design-Product/dp/1119240867

• Ask the Storybots on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/80108159

• Madhavan Ramanujam on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/the-art-and-science-of-pricing-madhavan-ramanujam-monetizing-innovation-simon-kucher/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Naomi’s background

(06:21) Why Evernote wasn’t able to leverage the kind of growth that Notion did

(08:06) What founders get wrong when it comes to monetization

(12:34) Which features to include in a freemium product

(13:22) Day one vs. day one-hundred premium features

(15:35) Matching price to value for optimal segmentation

(18:50) When pricing should be revisited

(19:38) How to determine price, and why it’s a good idea to have a cross-functional pricing team

(23:06) How to restructure pricing holistically 

(25:58) How Envoy learned that they were undercharging

(28:39) The importance of experimentation 

(32:19) How to balance growth with revenue

(35:12) What is the modern data stack?

(36:45) The modern growth stack

(42:22) The importance of experimentation in the growth stack

(42:59) Platforms for billing and monetization

(46:13) Why a hybrid model of pricing tends to be most used in SaaS companies

(49:01) Leveraging AI 

(49:52) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Yuhki Yamashita is Chief Product Officer at Figma. Prior to Figma, he was Head of Design of Uber’s New Mobility efforts, and before that a product manager at Google and Microsoft. Adding to his impressive resume, Yuhki also taught introductory computer science at Harvard. In today's episode, we talk about operationalizing quality, the case against OKRs, and how Figma isn't just known for product-led growth, but also for building a community of empowered users. Yuhki also shares why he thinks storytelling is key to being a great product manager, owning the "why," and the potential impact of Adobe's acquisition of Figma.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/an-inside-look-at-how-figma-builds-product-yuhki-yamashita-cpo-of-figma/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

• Flatfile—A CSV importer that says yes instead of error: mismatch: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

—

Where to find Yuhki Yamashita:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/yuhkiyam

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yuhki/

• Website: https://www.figma.com/@yuhki

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Yuhki’s guest post on Lenny’s Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-figma-builds-product

• Shishir Mehrotra on Lenny’s Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-rituals-of-great-teams-shishir-mehrotra-of/id1627920305?i=1000576021672

• Five Why’s template: https://www.figma.com/templates/5-whys-template/

• Dylan Field on Twitter: https://twitter.com/zoink

• Jeff Holden on Twitter: https://twitter.com/jeffholden

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Friends of Figma: https://friends.figma.com/

• Camille Ricketts on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-notion-leveraged-community-to-build-a-10b-business-camille-ricketts-notion-first-round-capital/

• Adobe Illustrator: https://www.adobe.com/products/illustrator/campaign/pricing.html

• Adobe Photoshop: https://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/

• Switch: How to Change Things When Change Is Hard: https://www.amazon.com/Switch-Change-Things-When-Hard/dp/0385528752/

• The Story of the Stone, or The Dream of the Red Chamber: https://www.amazon.com/Story-Stone-Dream-Chamber-Vol/dp/0140442936

• Serial podcast: https://serialpodcast.org/

• The Good Nurse on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81260083

• FigJam: https://www.figma.com/figjam/

• Asana: https://asana.com/

• Slack: https://slack.com/

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• Dropbox Paper: https://www.dropbox.com/paper/start

• Figma’s Alignment Scale: https://www.figma.com/community/widget/1030848035996871692

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Yuhki’s background

(09:05) What Yuhki learned from being on a design team

(10:29) Why managing designers is more difficult than managing product teams

(12:20) Why storytelling is important for product managers

(16:35) How to improve your storytelling skills 

(18:51) Why PMs need to know the “why” of the product they are managing

(22:34) The importance of developing a community and strong customer relationships

(26:13) How to use different types of feedback

(28:11) Working with Dylan Field

(32:44) Testing at Figma and the branching emerging feature

(34:54) Why your entire company should be using your product

(36:50) The importance of having personal accountability 

(38:48) Why Yuhki likes to stay out of the way of engineers fixing their own bugs

(40:50) Yuhki’s thoughts on OKRs and how they are used at Figma

(48:40) Figma’s interview process

(51:45) How Figma’s sales team works by creating human connections and empowering designers

(54:57) How Figma built community and created organic growth

(56:36) Advice for founders 

(58:57) The potential acquisition by Adobe and the future possibilities for Figma

(1:01:42) Closing thoughts 

(1:03:44) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Jules Walter is a product leader at YouTube and co-founder of both the Black Product Managers Network and Codepath.org. Previously, he led monetization and mobile growth teams at Slack. He’s also a very well-known leader in the broader product community. In today’s episode, we discuss the skills that matter most to PMs, and how to build those skills. We also spend quite a bit of time talking about the importance of finding mentors to help you learn new skills, how to nail your next job interview, barriers to entry for underrepresented people, and some of the most common paths into product management.

—

Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/leveraging-mentors-to-uplevel-your-career-jules-walter-youtube-slack/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Linear—The new standard for modern software development: https://linear.app/lenny

—

Where to find Jules Walter:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/julesdwalt

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/juleswalter/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Black Product Managers Network: https://www.blackproductmanagers.com

• Maryanna Quigless on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/quigless/

• Brittany Bankston on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brittany-bankston-77693a85/

• Benin Saffo on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/benin-saffo/

• Lawrence Ripsher on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lawrenceripsher/

• Matt Mochary on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary/

• Adriel Frederick on Lenny’s Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humanizing-product-development-adriel-frederick-reddit/id1627920305?i=1000583287891

• Bangaly Kaba on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iambangaly/

• The Minto Pyramid Principle: Logic in Writing, Thinking, and Problem Solving: https://www.amazon.com/Minto-Pyramid-Principle-Writing-Thinking/dp/0960191046

• Pathwise Leadership: https://pathwiseleadership.com/

• Erin Teague on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/erinteague/

• Bradley Horowitz on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bradleyhorowitz/

• Nikhyl Singhal on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nikhyl/

• Tim Ferriss on what makes a great mentor: https://www.businessinsider.com/tim-ferriss-what-makes-great-mentor-2017-11

• Never Split the Difference: Negotiating As If Your Life Depended on It: https://www.amazon.com/Never-Split-Difference-audiobook/dp/B01COR1GM2

• Connect: Building Exceptional Relationships with Family, Friends and Colleagues: https://www.amazon.com/Connect-Building-Exceptional-Relationships-Colleagues/dp/0241986869

• Chris Voss’s MasterClass on negotiating in the workplace: https://www.masterclass.com/sessions/classes/win-workplace-negotiations

• Lex Fridman’s podcast: https://lexfridman.com/podcast/

• Never Have I Ever on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/80179190

• Top Gun: Maverick on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KBTJBiL3oQ

Interview Prep Communities:

• Lewis C Lin's Interview Community: https://join.slack.com/t/pminterview/shared_invite/zt-1mqc5lzdt-SZuIvbzZIl8ob7UJeydVGg

• Exponent: https://www.tryexponent.com/

• StellarPeers: https://stellarpeers.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Jules’s background

(06:07) Two paths to becoming a product manager

(07:20) How Jules became the first growth PM at Slack

(09:03) Black Product Managers Network and Codepath.org

(12:05) The most important skills to refine as a PM: IQ skills and EQ skills

(14:48) How to improve your interview skills 

(18:50) Why interviewing is more difficult for underrepresented people

(20:39) EQ skills: what are they and how to improve them

(22:44) The EQ skills Jules has had to develop over the course of his career

(24:27) The importance of having a mentor or coach for self-reflection

(26:09) How cultivating self-awareness helped Jules improve his communication

(30:13) Strategies for learning new skills

(35:32) Improving strategy, execution, and product sense

(37:00) How identifying best practices can help you improve skills

(40:22) Communicating clearly and asking for feedback

(42:38) Methods Jules uses to improve skills

(45:31) How to approach asking for feedback

(47:46) Why it’s harder to get honest feedback on EQ skills

(50:56) The importance of understanding your strengths and weaknesses and leaning into the former

(55:18) Jules’s most impactful mentors

(56:14) The qualities to look for in a good mentor and how to approach them

(1:02:15) How to foster the best relationship with your mentor

(1:06:51) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

If you ever wanted to distill 3,310 hours of knowledge into 60 minutes, then this episode is for you. For the last 6 months, Lenny’s Podcast has been downloaded more than 2 million times and is now a top 10 technology podcast across both Apple and Spotify. And in this special episode, I’m breaking down the top 10 most downloaded episodes, plus sharing my favorite lessons from each. It's unlike anything I've done before, and I hope you love it. Happy holidays, happy new year, and from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much for listening, sharing, and for supporting the podcast. I’ll see you in 2023!

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/countdown-of-the-top-10-episodes-of-the-year/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• TED—ReThinking with Adam Grant: https://adamgrant.net/podcasts/rethinking/

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

The 10 most downloaded episodes of 2022:

* April Dunford on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/april-dunford-on-product-positioning-segmentation-and-optimizing-your-sales-process/

* Crystal Widjaja on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-scrappily-hire-for-measure-and-unlock-growth-crystal-widjaja-gojek-and-kumu/

* Julie Zhuo on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/julie-zhuo-on-accelerating-your-career-impostor-syndrome-writing-building-product-sense-using-intuition-vs-data-hiring-designers-and-moving-into-management/

* Shishir Mehrotra on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-rituals-of-great-teams-shishir-mehrotra-coda-youtube-microsoft/

* Kristen Berman on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/using-behavioral-science-to-improve-your-product-kristen-berman-irrational-labs/

* Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

* Ethan Smith on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-seo-ethan-smith-graphite/

* Shreyas Doshi on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/shreyas-doshi-on-pre-mortems-the-lno-framework-the-three-levels-of-product-work-why-most-execution-problems-are-strategy-problems-and-roi-vs-opportunity-cost-thinking/

* Marty Cagan on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-nature-of-product-marty-cagan-silicon-valley-product-group/

* Matt Mochary on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary-ceo-coach/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) About this episode

(02:46) April Dunford on positioning your product

(07:16) Crystal Widjaja on why most analytics efforts fail

(11:42) Julie Zhuo on overcoming imposter syndrome

(19:14) Shishir Mehrotra’s favorite interview question

(23:27) Shishir Mehrotra’s PSHE career growth framework

(27:10) Kristen Berman on using behavioral science to improve your product

(33:29) Elena Verna on why retention is so important

(36:31) Elena Verna on what to put into your freemium product

(37:57) Ethan Smith on how people often under-resource SEO

(38:46) Ethan Smith on when it’s time to invest in SEO

(42:41) Shreyas Doshi’s LNO Framework

(50:12) Marty Cagan on why big companies are often bad at product

(51:46) Marty Cagan’s four steps to being a good product manager

(53:48) Matt Mochary on the power of small teams

(57:17) Matt Mochary’s advice for making hard conversations easier

(59:05) Other episodes that left a lasting impact

(59:40) Thank you for joining me (Lenny) on this incredible journey

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Chris Hutchins recently left his position as Head of New Product Strategy at Wealthfront to focus full-time on his podcast, All the Hacks. If you’re thinking about starting your own podcast or are simply interested in the process, be sure to check out today’s episode. We dive deep on all things podcasting: the pros and cons, how to climb the charts, and how much time you should expect to spend on each episode from start to finish. We talk in-depth about the process, from pre-production to publication, and share all of the products we use for recording, editing, and publishing. Chris also offers some important tips and tricks on how to get your first subscribers and how to market and grow your podcast, as well as some incredible money-saving hacks that you can start implementing today.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/launching-and-growing-a-podcast-chris-hutchins-all-the-hacks-wealthfront-google/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

• Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

—

Where to find Chris Hutchins:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/hutchins

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrishutchins/

• Website: https://chrishutchins.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• All the Hacks podcast: https://www.allthehacks.com/

• All the Hacks newsletter: https://allthehacks.com/email

• Andy Rachleff on Twitter: https://twitter.com/arachleff

• Kerri Walsh Jennings on All the Hacks: https://www.allthehacks.com/performance-psychology-kerri-walsh-jennings/

• Descript: https://www.descript.com/

• Erika Taught Me podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/erika-taught-me/id1650076906

• Leigh Rowan on All the Hacks: https://www.allthehacks.com/travel-hacks-leigh-rowan/

• Kevin Kelly’s “1,000 True Fans”: https://kk.org/thetechnium/1000-true-fans/

• Emily Oster’s books: https://emilyoster.net/writing/

• Chris Hutchins on The Kevin Rose Show: https://podcast.kevinrose.com/guests/chris-hutchins/

• Nick Gray’s newsletter: https://nickgray.net/signup-for-email-updates/

• The 2-Hour Cocktail Party: How to Build Big Relationships with Small Gatherings: https://www.amazon.com/2-Hour-Cocktail-Party-Relationships-Gatherings-ebook/dp/B0B2KW6T7J

• MrBeast on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX6OQ3DkcsbYNE6H8uQQuVA

• Gary Vaynerchuk on Twitter: https://twitter.com/garyvee

• The Danny Miranda Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-danny-miranda-podcast/id1532160275

• Ray Dalio on Twitter: https://twitter.com/RayDalio

• Danny Miranda’s newsletter on Substack: https://dannymiranda.substack.com/

• ATRX2100 mic bundle on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-ATR2100X-USB-Microphone-Bundle-Filter/dp/B082SYHRY9/r

• Riverside: https://riverside.fm/

• Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Focusrite-Scarlett-Audio-Interface-Tools/dp/B07QR73T66

• Sony Alpha 7C mirrorless full-frame camera on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Sony-Alpha-Full-Frame-Mirrorless-Camera/dp/B08HVZLQ4F

• Adobe Audition: https://www.adobe.com/products/audition.html

• Pro Tools: https://www.avid.com/pro-tools

• Podpage: https://www.podpage.com/

• Simplecast: https://www.simplecast.com/

• Chartable: https://chartable.com/

• Podstatus: https://podstatus.com/

• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/

• Happy Money: https://www.amazon.com/Happy-Money-Ken-Honda-audiobook/dp/B07MJHJ57T/

• Vagabonding: An Uncommon Guide to the Art of Long-Term World Travel: https://www.amazon.com/Vagabonding-Uncommon-Guide-Long-Term-Travel/dp/0812992180

• Die with Zero: https://www.amazon.com/Die-Zero-Getting-Your-Money/dp/0358099765

• Animal Spirits Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/animal-spirits-podcast/id1310192007

• Mythic Quest on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/mythic-quest

• Unclaimed money: https://www.usa.gov/unclaimed-money

• Savendeals.com: https://www.savendeals.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Chris’s background

(03:25) Lesson’s from Wealthfront

(09:25) Why storytelling and communication are every bit as important as the product

(11:04) Why you need to understand the user’s experience and keep up with what others are building

(14:56) Why you should focus on overall impact, not just doing what your boss wants

(17:39) Why Chris likes working on big, crazy ideas

(19:10) The early days of Chris’s All the Hacks podcast

(21:34) The pros and cons of starting a podcast

(24:19) The time required to produce an episode

(27:09) How Lenny started his podcast 

(28:29) Launch lessons and how Apple rankings work

(30:49) Why you need to create authentic content

(32:57) Be one person’s favorite podcast

(35:01) How Chris ideated and titled All the Hacks

(40:09) How to get started and get your first subscribers

(43:52) How Gary Vaynerchuk used Twitter to establish authority 

(45:07) How to take advantage of platforms with built-in growth engines

(47:42) The power of in-person interviews

(48:57) How to pitch to other podcasts

(51:27) Equipment and products for producing podcasts

(57:36) How many downloads it takes in order to be taken seriously

(1:01:28) Using Overcast as a growth lever

(1:09:02) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Pete Kazanjy is the author of Founding Sales: The Early Stage Go-to-Market Handbook and the founder of Modern Sales Pros, an invite-only peer learning community focused on sales operations and sales leadership. He’s also the co-founder of Atrium, a B2B SaaS company that provides data-driven sales solutions. Pete got his start in product at VMware and then dove deep into the art and science of sales. In today’s episode, we talk about the importance of founder-led sales and how to methodically scale a sales department. He explains the difference between old-school sales and modern sales, which focuses on human connection and solving problems for customers. He also shares actionable tips to improve your sales technique and explains how to use data to monitor your success at different milestones in the sales process.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/founder-led-sales-pete-kazanjy-founding-sales-atrium/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

• Flatfile—A CSV importer that says yes instead of error: mismatch: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Merge—A single API to add hundreds of integrations into your app: http://merge.dev/lenny

—

Where to find Pete:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/Kazanjy

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kazanjy/

• Website: https://kazanjy.svbtle.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Founding Sales: The Early Stage Go-to-Market Handbook: https://www.amazon.com/Founding-Sales-Go-Market-Handbook-ebook/dp/B08PMK17Z1

• Brianne Kimmel’s SaaS school: http://briannekimmel.com/saas-school/

• Modern Sales Pros: https://modernsaleshq.com/

• The Lean Startup: How Today’s Entrepreneurs Use Continuous Innovation to Create Radically Successful Businesses: https://www.amazon.com/Lean-Startup-Entrepreneurs-Continuous-Innovation/dp/0307887898

• The Four Steps to the Epiphany: Successful Strategies for Products That Win: https://www.amazon.com/Four-Steps-Epiphany-Successful-Strategies/dp/1119690358/

• Pete’s presentation on founder-led sales: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAXIVAZJyPA

• Pete’s guest post on Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/sales-bottom-up

• The Cadence: How to Operate a SaaS Startup: https://medium.com/craft-ventures/the-cadence-how-to-operate-a-saas-startup-436aa8099e8

• Maker vs. Manager Schedule: http://www.paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Atrium: https://www.atriumhq.com/

• Greenhouse: https://www.greenhouse.io/

• Pete’s ICP Template: https://www.foundingsales.com/2-product-marketing#building-narrative

• Marissa Fuhrer Bell on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissafuhrer/

• Data-driven sales master class: https://salesnerds.atriumhq.com/msp-nailing-science-of-sales-figma-webinar-video

• The Goal: A Process of Ongoing Improvement: https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Process-Ongoing-Improvement/dp/0884271951

• The Score Takes Care of Itself: My Philosophy of Leadership: https://www.amazon.com/Score-Takes-Care-Itself-Philosophy/dp/1591843472

• All-In podcast: https://www.allinpodcast.co/

• Encanto on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/encanto/33q7DY1rtHQH

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) How Pete met Lenny 

(05:05) Pete’s background

(07:20) Modern sales vs. old-school sales

(09:17) What is founder-led sales, and why is it so important?

(14:58) When to hire your first salesperson 

(18:20) Why you should keep your in-person events to around 10 people

(19:34) What a sales motion is and why it needs to be updated regularly 

(20:55) What are the leading indicators of success?

(23:54) Why founders don’t need to be rock stars at sales

(28:28) Sales mindset changes—the number-one tip to improve your sales

(33:30) How modern sales should focus on helping customers solve problems

(36:00) A few tips to help you get better at sales

(36:40) ICP and personas

(39:14) Why you should hire junior sales staff in the early stages

(45:40) Signs your new hires aren’t a good fit

(47:38) The importance of using metrics for success

(49:33) Month-by-month expectations for sales hires

(51:19) Why work from home is bad for junior salespeople

(54:19) Why you shouldn’t be afraid of sales

(55:19) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Camille Ricketts began her career in journalism, at the Wall Street Journal, in 2006. In 2010 she joined Tesla, where she worked in communications alongside Elon Musk. She transitioned into marketing and became the Head of Content and Marketing at First Round Capital and then went on to become the very first marketing hire at Notion. In today’s episode, we dig into community-led growth—what it is, and when and how to pursue it. We get super-specific on how Notion championed their most loyal users and built a passionate community, and the incredible outcome it had for the company’s growth. We also talk about how to create great content, and how content can drive growth for your business and brand.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-notion-leveraged-community-to-build-a-10b-business-camille-ricketts-notion-first-round-capital/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments: https://www.geteppo.com/

• Flatfile—A CSV importer that says yes instead of error: mismatch: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Where to find Camille:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/camillericketts

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/camillericketts/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

People referenced:

• Ivan Zhao: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ivanhzhao/

• Simon Last: https://www.linkedin.com/in/simon-last-41404140/

• Lexie Barnhorn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexisbarnhorn/

• Ben Lang: https://www.linkedin.com/in/benmlang/

• Claire Butler: https://www.linkedin.com/in/clairetbutler/

• Jessi Craige Shikman at First Round: https://firstround.com/person/jessi-craige-shikman/

• Brett Berson at First Round: https://firstround.com/person/brett-berson/

• Josh Kopelman at First Round: https://firstround.com/person/josh-kopelman/#mystory

• Shaun Young on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shaunyou/

• David Pierce at The Verge: https://www.theverge.com/authors/david-pierce

• Francisco Cruz-Mendoza: https://www.linkedin.com/in/franciscocrz/

• Emma Yee Yick: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emmayeeyick/ 

Additionally, Camille would love to shout out Nate Martins and Andrea Lim, who ran Notion’s content program:

• Nate Martins: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nate-martins/

• Andrea Lim: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andreawlim/

Content and companies referenced:

• Community & Content Resources: https://tinyurl.com/yrxbb542

• Station F: https://stationf.co/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Canva: https://www.canva.com/

• Stripe: https://stripe.com/

• Stripe Atlas: https://stripe.com/atlas

• Salesforce: https://www.salesforce.com/

• First Round Review: https://review.firstround.com/

• Jobs to be done framework: https://jobs-to-be-done.com/jobs-to-be-done-a-framework-for-customer-needs-c883cbf61c90

• The Only App You Need for Work-Life Productivity: https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-only-app-you-need-for-work-life-productivity-1521640800

• Product Hunt: https://www.producthunt.com/

Referenced in lightning round:

• Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning So Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It: https://www.amazon.com/Obviously-Awesome-Product-Positioning-Customers/dp/1999023005

• April Dunford on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/april-dunford-on-product-positioning-segmentation-and-optimizing-your-sales-process/

• April Dunford’s guest post in Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/positioning

• Harry Stebbings’s podcast, 20VC: https://www.thetwentyminutevc.com/podcast/

• Lenny on 20VC: https://www.thetwentyminutevc.com/lenny-rachitsky/

• Tár: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt14444726/

• Fleishman Is in Trouble: https://www.hulu.com/series/fleishman-is-in-trouble-710e51f8-3387-404d-8b07-e7c9b766d11c

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• Arc: https://arc.net/

• Superhuman: https://superhuman.com/

• Cron: https://cron.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Camille’s background

(05:43) What it was like working with Elon Musk

(07:38) Working at Notion in the early days

(12:16) What is community-led growth?

(15:48) How Notion measured the impact of marketing efforts

(16:35) The most successful community efforts at Notion

(18:24) Why metrics aren’t always necessary for community growth 

(19:52) When it makes sense to invest in community-led growth

(21:34) How creators make money using Notion

(23:12) The Ambassador Program and Champions Program at Notion

(27:20) Why founders should consider investing in community and delay monetizing some features

(31:03) Companies that have done well in building community

(32:54) How to determine the level of community engagement appropriate for your company to invest in

(34:00) Using Camille’s 2x2 grid to implement community

(36:42) How to launch an ambassador program

(41:22) Advice for founders who want to build community

(47:17) How Lenny got his first 500 newsletter subscribers

(48:58) Examples of Camille’s most impactful content marketing

(51:20) Content-market fit: how to determine the needs of your reader 

(53:37) Content categories and the time it takes to create top-notch content

(57:02) The future of comms and how the press helped Notion grow

(1:01:35) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Madhavan Ramanujam is a senior partner at Simon-Kucher, where he works with tier-one tech companies like Uber, Asana, and LinkedIn to help them develop their pricing and monetization strategies. He’s also the author of the most widely read book on pricing strategy, Monetizing Innovation. In today’s podcast, we talk about all the elements that go into your pricing strategy. Madhavan gives real-life examples of having conversations about “willingness to pay,” how segmentation should impact your pricing, and when to start thinking about pricing. He also shares tips on how behavioral pricing impacts your thinking, how to restructure your pricing during a downturn, and much more.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-art-and-science-of-pricing-madhavan-ramanujam-monetizing-innovation-simon-kucher/#transcript

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Lemon.io—a marketplace of vetted software developers. Get your match within 48h: https://lemon.io/lenny

• Mixpanel—product analytics that everyone can trust, use, and afford: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Miro—a collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny

—

Where to find Madhavan Ramanujam:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/madhavansf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/madhavan-ramanujam-1533063/

• Website: https://www.simon-kucher.com/en-us/leadership

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Monetizing Innovation: https://www.amazon.com/Monetizing-Innovation-Companies-Design-Product/dp/1119240867

• It’s Price Before Product. Period: https://review.firstround.com/its-price-before-product-period

• Rahul Vohra on NFX podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCiMqVC6Dok

• Leaders, Killers, and Fillers framework: https://kevinacohn.medium.com/leaders-fillers-and-killers-creating-bundles-that-work-7f4c7329cf53

• Predictably Irrational: https://www.amazon.com/Predictably-Irrational-Revised-Expanded-Decisions/dp/0061353248

• Preorder Unlocking Growth: https://www.amazon.com/Maximize-Profits-Prices-Products-Services/dp/1119633060

• Confessions of the Pricing Man: https://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Pricing-Man-Affects-Everything/dp/B08TZPRKVY

• Simon-Kucher books: https://www.simon-kucher.com/en-us/resources/books

• Mastering SaaS pricing (Kyle Poyar): https://www.saas-knowledge-base.com/docs/mastering-saas-pricing-from-mvp-to-ipo

• 6 Must-Reads on Pricing a Product: https://review.firstround.com/our-6-must-reads-on-pricing-a-product

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:24) Madhavan’s background

(06:29) How Madhavan got into pricing and monetization

(08:02 ) Why he wrote Monetizing Innovation

(09:43) Why pricing is a cross-functional discipline, but ultimately a function of product

(11:27) What “willingness to pay” is, and why founders need to have conversations about it early and often

(15:23) How Porsche built their SUV around customer feedback and willingness to pay

(18:46) How testing helped a marketplace company avoid building something customers don’t value

(23:50) Several methods to use to learn willingness to pay

(33:38) When and how the willingness-to-pay conversations happen

(37:08) How many customers you should be talking to

(38:13) When to revisit pricing

(39:20) Segmentation strategies

(42:42) Why you need to act differently to your segments that have different needs

(44:33) When to think about segmentation

(47:49) Examples of segmentation done well

(52:24) The importance of dynamic segmentation

(53:19) The three pricing strategies: maximizing, penetrating, and skimming

(55:49) How to use bundling and packaging to unlock segmentation

(59:50) Why how you charge is more important than how much

(1:03:30) Subscription vs. usage 

(1:07:40) Pricing options and structures

(1:10:22) How to run tests to see which pricing model works best

(1:12:06) Focusing on benefits vs. features

(1:16:13) What behavioral pricing is and why it’s important

(1:20:54) Tactics for behavioral pricing

(1:26:33) Determining pricing thresholds 

(1:28:23) Tips for pricing in a depressed market

(1:32:50) Madhavan’s new book

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Sahil Mansuri is the CEO of Bravado, the world’s largest online sales community. Sahil is passionate about sales, and his experience dates all the way back to 2008, working for Obama’s presidential campaign. During his time at Glassdoor, Sahil was able to close some incredible accounts, including Facebook, Google, Microsoft, and Amazon. In today’s podcast, we talk about why sales is a crucial part of any business and how to continue selling successfully through a recession. We get super-specific on building a conservative plan for the near future and cover everything from where to place your best salespeople to restructuring comp plans. The episode is full of great advice about how to shift with this market, improve agility, and perhaps grow an even stronger business with happier customers. 

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-hit-revenue-targets-in-a-recession-sahil-mansuri-bravado/#transcript

—

Where to find Sahil Mansuri:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/svmansuri

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sahilmansuri/

• Email: sahil@bravado.co

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Merge: http://merge.dev/lenny

• Miro: https://miro.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Bravado: https://bravado.co/

• Stumbling on Happiness: https://www.amazon.com/Stumbling-Happiness-Daniel-Gilbert/dp/1400077427

• All-In podcast: https://www.allinpodcast.co/

• How I Built This podcast: https://www.npr.org/series/490248027/how-i-built-this

• The Blacklist on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/70281312

• The Newsroom on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/the-newsroom-3d51e070-e77d-4294-ac83-cab80d3f94dd

• The West Wing on HBO Max: https://www.hbomax.com/series/urn:hbo:series:GX5nwgQDNJZ6aoQEAAAHJ

• Jeopardy!: https://www.jeopardy.com/watch

• Frasier on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/frasier-0cb9b63b-de82-4751-99c9-1cb12118ab9d

• Slack: https://slack.com/

• Zoom: https://zoom.us/

• Grain: https://grain.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:19) Sahil’s background

(08:26) What is Bravado? 

(10:27) How to shift your sales strategy to meet the market

(12:00) How to set a conservative plan that still allows you to lean in when growth is possible

(19:06) Why the downturn in tech may not be over anytime soon

(21:34) How Bravado gets its data from users and creates global benchmarks 

(23:04) Why SAAS has an outdated comp structure

(33:23) Why companies are resistant to restructuring comp plans

(37:18) The problem with hypergrowth in today’s market

(41:18) Why it’s time to shift into a retention-based strategy

(43:28) Why your best sales staff should transition to post-sales for customer retention

(51:20) What are warm intros, and how can existing customers help you get new ones?

(59:30) How Sahil was able to get Facebook’s account at Glassdoor

(1:08:08) Why CEOs are actually salespeople

(1:12:50) How to survive a downturn

(1:19:44) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ethan Smith is the CEO of Graphite, a boutique growth agency that’s helped companies like MasterClass, Thumbtack, Robinhood, Medium, and Honey develop and execute their SEO strategies. SEO is one of the least-understood levers for growth, while also one with the biggest payoff. This episode is a true master class on all things SEO. Ethan shares a wealth of information, including when you should begin investing in SEO, how to build an SEO team, and the three main buckets of SEO. He explains the difference between topics and keywords, gives the exact heuristics and tools to help you be successful in developing and implementing your own SEO strategy, and also goes deep on how to deal with roadblocks and advocate for resources.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-seo-ethan-smith-graphite/#transcript

—

Where to find Ethan Smith:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ethan_l_s

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethanls/

• Graphite: https://www.graphitehq.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: https://coda.io/lenny

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Lemon.io: https://lemon.io/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Product-Led SEO: The Why Behind Building Your Organic Growth Strategy https://a.co/d/2wkN4dx

• Topical Authority Analysis: https://bit.ly/topical-authority-tool

• SEO Link Analysis: https://bit.ly/diagnostic-internal-links

• SEO Links API: https://bit.ly/graphite-internal-links-api

• Screaming Frog: https://www.screamingfrog.co.uk/seo-spider/

• Brandon Lee of Power: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandonhli

• Similarweb traffic analysis: https://www.similarweb.com/

• MasterClass: https://www.masterclass.com/

• BetterUp: https://www.betterup.com/

• NerdWallet: https://www.nerdwallet.com/

• HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/

• Ahrefs: https://ahrefs.com/

• Semrush: https://www.semrush.com/

• Google Search Console: https://search.google.com/search-console/about

• Clearscope: https://www.clearscope.io/

• Yuriy Timen on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-grow-a-subscription-business-yuriy-timen-grammarly-canva-airtable/

• Gokul Rajaram on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gokul-rajaram-on-designing-your-product-development-process-when-and-how-to-hire-your-first-pm-a-playbook-for-hiring-leaders-getting-ahead-in-you-career-how-to-get-started-angel-investing-more/

• Luc Levesque on Twitter: https://twitter.com/luclevesque

• Search Off the Record: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/search-off-the-record/id1512522198

• GPT-3: https://gpt3demo.com/apps/openai-gpt-3-playground

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:53) Ethan’s background

(07:53) Why technical audits are the biggest myth in SEO

(10:05) When to invest in SEO

(16:09) Heuristics to determine if SEO is worth it

(18:36) The three buckets of SEO: programmatic, editorial, and technical

(23:30) The process for creating an SEO strategy

(27:00) Why you shouldn’t be too formulaic 

(28:33) What is site engagement?

(29:31) Which pages need to be indexed

(31:49) Topics vs. keywords

(36:33) How to mine competitors’ sites for information

(37:41) Useful tools for developing your SEO strategy

(40:14) How long will it take to see results?

(45:16) Factors to consider when looking to hire an SEO person

(47:33) The functions of a programmatic SEO person

(49:19) How to do testing

(54:06) Editorial SEO strategy

(57:14) How to scale based on the size of the site

(59:51) Page types

(1:01:53) How to win in a topic category

(1:03:12) How to build solid hypotheses and test them 

(1:06:13) How to deal with roadblocks and advocate for resources

(1:08:54) How topical and domain authority are determined

(1:16:43) The power of internal links

(1:24:32) Why AI is not usually useful for content creation

(1:28:31) Final tips for getting started with SEO

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Petra Wille is an independent product leadership coach who’s been helping product teams expand their skill sets since 2013. She’s also the author of Strong Product People, which she published in 2021. Alongside her freelance work, Petra curates and co-organizes Mind The Product Engage Hamburg. She started her career as a software developer and in 2008 went to work at Xing, a German social media site, where she learned from two incredible product leaders: Marty Cagan and Jason Goldberg. In today’s podcast, we talk about Petra’s book, and how to help your team grow as a product leader. Petra also shares how to improve your storytelling skills, get better at public speaking, and why community is so important for product managers.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-be-the-best-coach-to-product-people-petra-wille-strong-product-people/#transcript

—

Where to find Petra Wille:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/loomista

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petra-wille-b8b1329/?originalSubdomain=de

• Website: https://www.petra-wille.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov27

—

Referenced:

• PMwheel framework: https://www.strongproductpeople.com/pmwheel

• Marty Cagan’s assessment: https://www.svpg.com/coaching-tools-the-assessment/

• PM Daisy: https://pmdaisy.com/

• The Eisenhower matrix for prioritization: https://www.productplan.com/glossary/eisenhower-matrix/

• Continuous Discovery Habits: Discover Products that Create Customer Value and Business Value: https://www.amazon.com/Continuous-Discovery-Habits-Discover-Products/dp/1736633309

• Mochary Method Curriculum: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18FiJbYn53fTtPmphfdCKT2TMWH-8Y2L-MLqDk-MFV4s/edit

• Matt Mochary on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary/

• Hans Rosling’s Ted talks: https://www.ted.com/speakers/hans_rosling

• Sarah Kay: If I should have a daughter: https://www.ted.com/talks/sarah_kay_if_i_should_have_a_daughter?

• Nobody Wants to Read Your Sh*t: Why That is and What You Can Do About It: https://www.amazon.com/Nobody-Wants-Read-Your-Sh-ebook/dp/B01GZ1TJBI

• Selling the Dream: https://www.amazon.com/Selling-Dream-Guy-Kawasaki/dp/0887306004

• Nancy Duarte’s website: https://www.duarte.com/

• The 72 Rules of Storytelling: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/72-rules-commercial-storytelling-jeremy-waite/

• The Art of Thinking Clearly:https://www.amazon.com/Art-Thinking-Clearly-Rolf-Dobelli/dp/0062219693

• Outcomes Over Output: https://www.amazon.com/Outcomes-Over-Output-customer-behavior/dp/1091173265

• Martin Erickson’s Decision Stack: https://martineriksson.com/the-decision-stack

• Present Yourself Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/womentalkdesign/present-yourself-a-public-speaking-book

• The Product Experience podcast: https://www.mindtheproduct.com/the-product-experience/

• Product podcast in German: https://www.produktmenschen.de/

• Watch New Amsterdam on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/new-amsterdam

• Harvest bookkeeping and time tracking: https://www.getharvest.com/

• Qanto: https://qonto.com/en

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:35) Petra’s background

(05:51) The things leaders of product teams don’t always understand

(09:33) Why Petra wrote the book Strong Product People to help managers of product teams 

(11:21) The five ingredient coaching method

(17:00) Why Petra usually recommends starting coaching with a development plan

(19:31) Why weekly time should be carved out for ‘people development’

(21:16) How to define a competent PM in your organization and tools to help you

(24:06) Petra’s PM Wheel and how she developed it

(27:36) Other info product leads will find useful in Petra’s book

(30:46) Tips for coaching your team

(35:17) How to improve your storytelling

(40:56) How to get better at public speaking

(44:45) Why it’s important to develop good storytelling and public speaking skills 

(53:36) The importance of a community of practice for product people

(56:14) Why people tend to stick around when they are supported and growing in a community

(57:53) What to look for in a community

(1:06:48) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ian McAllister is the Senior Director of Product for Vehicles at Uber. Before moving to Uber, Ian spent over a decade directing teams at Amazon, where he created and led Amazon Smile. He was also Director of Product Management at Airbnb, where I was lucky enough to have worked alongside him. In today’s episode, we discuss Ian’s famous document about the essential attributes of the top 1% of product managers. Ian outlines the most important skills to focus on for entry-level PMs and how to broaden your experience and diversify skills as you move up the ladder. He also shares what he learned working with Jeff Wilke, Jeff Bezos, and other leaders at Amazon, and goes in depth on Amazon’s working-backwards framework. 

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/what-it-takes-to-become-a-top-1-pm-ian-mcallister-uber-amazon-airbnb/#transcript

—

Where to find Ian McAllister:

• Newsletter: https://ianmcallister.substack.com/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ianmcall

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ianmcallister/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov20

—

Referenced:

• What distinguishes the top 1% of product managers from the top 10%, on Substack: https://ianmcallister.substack.com/p/what-distinguishes-the-top-1-of-product

• What distinguishes the top 1% of product managers from the top 10%, on Quora: https://www.quora.com/What-distinguishes-the-Top-1-of-product-managers-from-the-Top-10

• Amazon’s working-backwards method: https://www.productplan.com/glossary/working-backward-amazon-method/

• Jeff Wilke on Twitter: https://twitter.com/jeffawilke

• Getting Real: The Smarter, Faster, Easier Way to Build a Successful Web Application: https://www.amazon.com/Getting-Real-Smarter-Successful-Application/dp/0578012812

• Wool (Wool trilogy #1): https://www.amazon.com/Wool-Trilogy-Howey-25-Apr-2013-Paperback/dp/B011T7ACU0/

• Energy and Civilization: A History: https://www.amazon.com/Energy-Civilization-History-MIT-Press/dp/0262035774

• How I Built This podcast: https://www.npr.org/series/490248027/how-i-built-this

• EV News Daily podcast: https://www.evnewsdaily.com/

• Yellowstone on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/yellowstone

• Everything Everywhere All at Once on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/titles/3493875/everything-everywhere-all-at-once

• Gibson Biddle’s website: https://www.gibsonbiddle.com/

• Gibson Biddle on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gibson-biddle-on-his-dhm-product-strategy-framework-gem-roadmap-prioritization-framework-5-netflix-strategy-mini-case-studies-building-a-personal-board-of-directors-and-much-more/

• Gibson Biddle’s Ask Gib newsletter: https://askgib.substack.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:54) What Ian expected from his initial post on product management

(05:30) How the post impacted Ian’s career

(07:06) How writing can help you crystallize your thoughts

(08:26) Ian’s background

(10:57) Attributes of the top 1% of PMs

(14:32) The top three skills for new PMs to perfect

(20:32) Tips on strengthening communication and prioritization

(23:06) How to level up as a PM

(26:37) What kind of impact should new PMs expect to make?

(29:36) How to broaden your view and think big

(33:06) How to earn the trust of others

(34:30) How Ian could have done more to earn trust at Airbnb

(37:27) Why people tend to stick around Amazon for a while 

(39:53) What Ian learned from Bezos and Wilke

(46:38) How teams get working backwards wrong

(53:51) The two parts of working backwards and how Ian utilizes it at Uber

(58:57) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Gergely Orosz writes the #1 technology newsletter at Substack, called The Pragmatic Engineer. He started his career as a software developer in the U.K., spent three years at Skype, and followed that role with four years as an engineering manager at Uber before deciding to leave big tech and work for himself. Gergely began pursuing his newsletter full-time in September 2021 and in just one year has amassed 200,000 subscribers. He now makes more money than he did at his salaried tech job, and with freedom and flexibility. In today’s podcast, Gergely shares why he left his well-paying job at Uber, how he got his first 1,000 subscribers, why this kind of work can be stressful and lonely (but ultimately rewarding), and why it takes hard work to build authority and become a great writer. Working solo can be challenging, and in this episode, both Lenny and Gergely offer tips for structuring your unstructured time and finding your focus.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/leaving-big-tech-to-build-the-1-technology-newsletter-gergely-orosz-the-pragmatic-engineer/#transcript

—

Where to find Gergely Orosz:

• Website: https://www.pragmaticengineer.com/

• Newsletter: https://newsletter.pragmaticengineer.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/GergelyOrosz

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gergelyorosz/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Lemon.io: https://lemon.io/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Gergely’s books: https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/books/

• Centered: https://www.centered.app/

• The Pomodoro technique: https://www.forbes.com/sites/bryancollinseurope/2020/03/03/the-pomodoro-technique/

• Coding Horror: https://blog.codinghorror.com/

• How to Achieve Ultimate Blog Success in One Easy Step: https://blog.codinghorror.com/how-to-achieve-ultimate-blog-success-in-one-easy-step/

• A Comment Is an Invitation for Refactoring: https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/a-comment-is-an-invitation-for-refactoring/

• Kent Beck’s website: https://www.kentbeck.com/

• Steve Yegge’s famous rant on Google vs. Amazon: https://www.alexanderjarvis.com/steve-yegges-famous-rant-on-google-vs-amazon/

• Stevey’s Tech Talk: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZfuUWMTtMcC1DZF6HxJhqsGrBXu8Jzi7

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:32) Gergely’s background

(07:19) The Pragmatic Engineer, growth and current subscribers 

(08:59) Compensation with a subscription-based newsletter vs. his salaried position at Uber

(10:55) How the onset of Covid and layoffs at Uber prompted Gergely to start his newsletter

(23:10) What he did immediately after leaving Uber

(25:41) The day-to-day of writing a newsletter

(35:08) Tips for productivity

(41:19) Gergely’s favorite parts of entrepreneurship 

(43:15) The downsides of solo work

(50:39) Why Gergely stopped making long-term plans

(54:30) How to get started writing a newsletter

(1:04:48) Key advice on building a successful newsletter

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Alex Hardiman is Chief Product Officer at the New York Times, where she oversees the company’s news, cooking, games, audio and advertising products. Previously, Alex was Chief Business & Product Officer at The Atlantic, and before that she was Head of News Products at Facebook. We discuss how engineers and product people work with writers to create impactful stories, how teams build the incredible visualizations and experiences for NYTimes.com, how product teams are structured within the New York Times, and the good and bad about working at a company like the New York Times versus a FAANG tech company. We also talk about the details behind the New York Times’s acquisition of Wordle and uncover what the Times is dreaming up for its product over the next 10 years.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/an-inside-look-at-how-the-new-york-times-builds-product-alex-hardiman-cpo-at-the-new-york-times/#transcript

—

Where to find Alex Hardiman:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/alex_hardiman

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexandrahardiman/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Miro: https://miro.com/lenny

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Jodi Kantor: https://www.nytimes.com/by/jodi-kantor

• Wordle: https://www.nytimes.com/games/wordle/

• Wordle Is a Love Story: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/03/technology/wordle-word-game-creator.html

• Josh Wardle on Twitter: https://twitter.com/powerlanguish

• Eric Kim’s recipes: https://cooking.nytimes.com/ourcooks/eric-kim/

• Wirecutter: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/

• Framing Britney Spears: https://www.nytimes.com/article/framing-britney-spears.html

• Hard Fork podcast: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/04/podcasts/hard-fork-technology.html

• High Growth Handbook: Scaling Startups from 10 to 10,000 People: https://www.amazon.com/High-Growth-Handbook-Elad-Gil/dp/1732265100

• An Elegant Puzzle: Systems of Engineering Management: https://www.amazon.com/Elegant-Puzzle-Systems-Engineering-Management/dp/1732265186

• The Revolt of the Public and the Crisis of Authority in the New Millennium: https://www.amazon.com/Revolt-Public-Crisis-Authority-Millennium/dp/1732265143

• Giovanni’s Room: https://www.amazon.com/Giovannis-Room-James-Baldwin/dp/0345806565/r

• The Daily podcast: https://www.nytimes.com/column/the-daily

• The Wire on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-wire

• Google Workspace: https://workspace.google.com/

• Slack: slack.com

• Figma: figma.com

• Mode: https://mode.com/

• GitHub: https://github.com/

• Fidji Simo on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fidjisimo/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:48) Alex’s background

(07:37) How Alex fought disinformation on the news team at Facebook 

(11:11) How some product people thrive in chaos

(14:13) Alex’s return to the New York Times

(16:22) What product means at the New York Times

(20:42) How the product team at the New York Times is structured

(26:20) How the New York Times makes stories come alive with balanced creative and technical teams

(33:15) The acquisition of Wordle 

(42:00) What it was like to work at the New York Times during the onset of Covid

(47:11) How to avoid burnout on a product team

(49:26) How the New York Times has set itself apart with its subscription package

(52:21) How the New York Times’s products are rooted in helping in the real world

(52:54) Lenny’s tips for improving Wirecutter

(53:36) The differences and similarities on product teams in a news organization

(59:58) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Matt Mochary, CEO of Mochary Method, is a full-time executive coach who has worked with some of the biggest names in tech and finance, including investor Naval Ravikant and the CEOs of Notion, OpenAI, Coinbase, Reddit, and many others. In today’s podcast, we talk about the skill of firing people, why it’s so important, and Matt’s framework for approaching layoffs. We go deep on recognizing emotions like anger and fear, and what to pay attention to when you feel angry or fearful. He also shares how to build new products within a larger company, important tips on how to make sure everyone in the organization feels valued and heard, carving out time for your top goal, and how an energy audit can help you eliminate tasks that are draining your energy.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary-ceo-coach/#transcript

—

Where to find Matt Mochary:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/mattmochary

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-mochary-34bb4/

• Website: http://www.mochary.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov10

• Lemon.io: https://lemon.io/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• The Great CEO Within: The Tactical Guide to Company Building: https://www.amazon.com/Great-CEO-Within-Tactical-Building-ebook/dp/B07ZLGQZYC

• Mochary Method: https://mocharymethod.org/

• Leo Polovets on Twitter: https://twitter.com/lpolovets

• High Output Management: https://www.amazon.com/High-Output-Management-Andrew-Grove/dp/0679762884

• The Hard Thing About Hard Things: Building a Business when There Are No Easy Answers: https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Thing-About-Things-Building/dp/0062273205

• Andrej Karpathy on Lex Fridman’s podcast: https://lexfridman.com/andrej-karpathy/

• Wei Deng on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dengwei/

• Free Solo: https://films.nationalgeographic.com/free-solo

• Ryan Hoover on Twitter: https://twitter.com/rrhoover

• Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less: https://gregmckeown.com/books/essentialism/

• Make Time: How to Focus on What Matters Every Day: https://www.amazon.com/Make-Time-Focus-Matters-Every/dp/0525572422

• Centered app: https://www.centered.app/

• Diana Chapman at Conscious Leadership Group: https://conscious.is/team/diana-chapman

• The Mochary Method curriculum doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18FiJbYn53fTtPmphfdCKT2TMWH-8Y2L-MLqDk-MFV4s/edit

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:43) Matt’s background

(07:39) Areas where even very successful founders struggle

(12:24) How to address people to minimize defensiveness

(13:24) The destructive nature of anger and how to feel your feelings so you don’t hurt others

(15:02) Which books led Matt to his coaching journey and software platform

(19:03) When and how to let an employee go

(31:47) How to make people feel heard

(38:05) How Matt’s coaching has evolved to include psychological obstacles to success

(39:41) What is “top goal,” and how can it help you make massive gains?

(41:25) Why Matt has an accountability partner for his top goal time

(43:44) How to approach mass layoffs humanely

(53:21) Matt’s thoughts on the Twitter layoffs

(54:10) How to innovate within a large company

(1:01:53) How to do an energy audit

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ben Williams is VP of Product at Snyk, an industry-leading security platform for developers, last valued at $8.5b. He’s also a product and growth advisor with over 20 years of experience building and scaling high-performing product and growth teams. Through product-led growth, product-led sales, and community, Snyk rapidly scaled and won over the lucrative developer audience. In today’s episode, Ben shares the successful growth levers that helped Snyk get started, all of the details of how Snyk has structured their growth, product, and marketing teams and set them up for success in terms of cross-collaboration—and also how their initial plan for self-serve monetization fell flat. We go into Ben’s many useful tips for product-led growth, including his thoughts on free vs. paid versions, trials, and how to build amazing growth teams.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-snyk-built-a-product-led-growth-juggernaut-ben-williams-vp-of-product-at-snyk/#transcript

—

Where to find Ben Williams:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/semanticben

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/semanticben/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: https://coda.io/lenny

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Snyk: https://snyk.io/

• Weekly Team Impact & Learnings Review Template: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1GibNaJ4aONgp5Kg824NCionr1citHIDk3FLvMdkpX_Q/edit?usp=share_link

• Monthly Group Impact & Learnings Review Template: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1nQ18OTuRtc8urBnUWEObD_BlfdGDKlDDMFg8-G2GK7E/edit?usp=share_link

• Experiment Plan Template: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18LiGXKphGe1tUpZCQA20i4bJqf-S3kDbYnY4Pls_9kQ/edit?usp=share_link

• Vision & Mission Framework: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1CiRwscu-50lBr2c7yRLY_zXVzv5DCnYqNnS5Au83WC8/edit?usp=share_link

• Ed Sim’s newsletter: https://whatshot.substack.com/

• Tamar Yehoshua on Twitter: https://twitter.com/tyehoshua

• Julian Shapiro on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/growth-tactics-retention-strategies-and-becoming-a-better-writer-julian-shapiro-demand-curve-hyper-webflow-techcrunch/

• Annie Duke’s website: https://www.annieduke.com/

• Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

• Growth loops: https://www.reforge.com/blog/growth-loops

• Brian Balfour on using learnings: https://brianbalfour.com/growth-machine/maximize-learning

• Adam Fishman on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-build-a-high-performing-growth-team-adam-fishman-patreon-lyft-imperfect-foods/

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• FullStory: https://www.fullstory.com/

• User Interviews: https://www.userinterviews.com/

• User Testing: https://www.usertesting.com/

• Sprig: https://sprig.com/surveys

• Airtable: https://www.airtable.com/home/toolkit

• How to Measure Anything: Finding the Value of “Intangibles” in Business: https://www.amazon.com/dp/0470110120/

• Sprint: How to Solve Big Problems and Test New Ideas in Just Five Days: https://www.amazon.com/Sprint-Solve-Problems-Test-Ideas/dp/150112174X

• Make Time: How to Focus on What Matters Every Day: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078QSCM3V/

• This Is How They Tell Me the World Ends: The Cyberweapons Arms Race: https://www.amazon.com/This-They-Tell-World-Ends/dp/1635576059

• Acquired podcast: https://www.acquired.fm/

• Turning Red on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/turning-red/4mFPCXJi7N2m

• Curb Your Enthusiasm on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/curb-your-enthusiasm

• Christine Itwaru’s blog: https://prodops.blog/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:44) Ben’s background

(07:27) What is Snyk, and what’s the current scale?

(08:45) Why Ben joined Snyk

(09:29) How Snyk got their first 100 users

(15:14) How Snyk used developer conferences and in-person meet-ups to launch

(19:23) How Snyk used GitHub as a growth lever

(23:50) Snyk Advisor, and other growth loops Snyk successfully used

(26:56) Snyk’s failed attempt at self-serve monetization

(31:21) How to win the hearts and minds of developers

(33:38) How adding sales and marketing teams helped Snyk gain momentum

(35:11) The evolution of Snyk’s growth team

(37:26) Snyk’s key areas of growth and how Ben solved tension between teams

(39:32) What is Snyk’s decision science team?

(40:59) Why Snyk has a growth marketer embedded on each team

(43:39) The importance of having an amazing SEO person

(46:21) Advice on building growth teams

(51:32) Ben’s vision and mission framework

(53:53) More on the growth process and experimentation

(56:04) Using learnings as a path to impact

(57:32) Growth strategy

(1:02:26) Data in growth teams

(1:06:33) How Snyk socializes learnings

(1:10:05) How Snyk structures their product org

(1:13:15) Free vs. paid features and how to approach trials

(1:18:57) Activation milestones at Snyk

(1:23:05) The most valuable tools for Snyk’s growth team

(1:25:21) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Lauren Ipsen is one of the most well-known and respected executive recruiters in the industry, having placed over 90 senior product leaders at companies including Twitter, Reddit, Opendoor, Postmates, Nextdoor, and many others. She is currently the Director of Executive Talent at General Catalyst, and prior to that was a senior leader at Daversa Partners. In today’s podcast, Lauren shares advice for founders on hiring senior product leaders, tips for product leaders on finding better opportunities, and the most common mistakes recruiters make. She talks about how to play the long game of networking to find the best talent and about recruiting best practices, and we also dive deep on market mapping, LinkedIn, and how to approach reference checks.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/lessons-from-one-of-the-worlds-top-executive-recruiters-lauren-ipsen-daversa-partners-general-catalyst/#transcript

—

Where to find Lauren Ipsen:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lauren-ipsen-6a5a84113/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Retool: https://retool.com/lenny

• Miro: https://miro.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Gokul Rajaram on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gokul-rajaram-on-designing-your-product-development-process-when-and-how-to-hire-your-first-pm-a-playbook-for-hiring-leaders-getting-ahead-in-you-career-how-to-get-started-angel-investing-more/

• The Power of Now: A Guide to Spiritual Enlightenment:  https://www.amazon.com/Power-Now-Guide-Spiritual-Enlightenment/dp/1577314808

• You Are Here: Discovering the Magic of the Present Moment: https://www.amazon.com/You-Are-Here-Discovering-Present/dp/1590308387/

• Your Own Backyard podcast: https://www.yourownbackyardpodcast.com/

• Top Gun: https://www.amazon.com/Top-Gun-Tom-Cruise/dp/B001K3K5MO

• BeReal: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/bereal-your-friends-for-real/id1459645446

• Strava: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/strava-run-ride-hike/id426826309

• Spotify: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/spotify-music-and-podcasts/id324684580

• Joe Suliman at Daversa Partners: https://www.daversapartners.com/team/joe-suliman/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:46) Lauren’s background

(07:52) Why the best recruiters seem to be migrating to VC funds

(09:44) Mistakes founders make in searching for their first senior product leader

(13:26) Questions for founders to ask when thinking about who to hire

(16:07) The three main types of PMs

(18:27) What do job titles mean, and why are they more susceptible to change in a startup environment?

(21:50) What should product leaders do ahead of hiring senior product leaders?

(23:14) How to network with great talent

(27:37) Why the timetable for recruiting is variable

(29:02) How to be productive with your time by tapping your network

(30:27) Why recruiting via LinkedIn might not be the best use of your time

(33:17) Lauren’s favorite placement of all time

(37:30) The importance of diversifying your experience

(40:16) The art and science of staying long enough to have a meaningful impact

(43:23) The importance of creating real impact as a leader

(47:57) Good questions to ask references and how to dig deeper

(49:35) Resume red flags and the importance of honesty

(53:39) Interview tips for product managers 

(57:29) Common mistakes recruiters make

(1:00:57) Advice for founders looking for a recruiter

(1:04:24) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Sachin Monga is the Head of Product at Substack, a platform that I personally use every day, and love. Before Substack, Sachin co-founded an app called Cocoon, which he ended up selling to Substack. Before that, he spent over seven years at Facebook as a PM working on video and camera products, building out the developer platform, and leading the ads growth team. In today’s episode, we dive deep on all things Substack. Sachin shares what it’s like transitioning from a large product team at Facebook to a small growth team. He discusses how to work with a hands-on founder and why you must be comfortable with rapid change in a PM role. He also shares unique features of Substack that make it an optimized experience for readers and writers, how he’d like to see it improved, and tips for anyone wanting to get started writing online.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-substack-sachin-monga-substack-facebook/#transcript

—

Where to find Sachin Monga:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/sachinmonga

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sachinmonga/

• Email: Sachin@substackinc.com

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Retool: https://retool.com/lenny

• Stytch: https://stytch.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Substack: https://substack.com/

• Matt Taibbi on Substack: https://taibbi.substack.com/

• Bill Bishop on Substack: https://sinocism.com/

• Jasper: https://www.jasper.ai/

• DALL-E 2: https://openai.com/dall-e-2/

• 1000 True Fans: https://www.amazon.com/1000-True-Fans-Kellys-Simple-ebook/dp/B01N9P9O4G

• You Are Not Late: https://medium.com/message/you-are-not-late-b3d76f963142

• The Timeless Way of Building: https://www.amazon.com/Timeless-Way-Building-Christopher-Alexander/dp/0195024028

• Martyrmade podcast on Substack: https://martyrmade.substack.com/

• Colin Meloy on Substack: https://colinmeloy.substack.com/

• Ethan Strauss on Substack: https://houseofstrauss.substack.com/

• Kareem Abdul-Jabbar on Substack: https://kareem.substack.com/

• Dayne Rathbone: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daynerathbone/

• For All Mankind on Apple TV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/for-all-mankind/umc.cmc.6wsi780sz5tdbqcf11k76mkp7

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:34) Sachin’s background

(07:11) The evolution and structure of teams at Substack

(10:11) What it’s like working at a smaller company with a hands-on founder

(12:07) How to share in a founder’s vision

(14:02) Why the rate of change is the most challenging aspect of the job

(16:37) Why prioritization at Facebook worked differently than it does at Substack

(20:03) How Substack thinks about prioritizing for writers and readers

(22:17) Substack’s recommendation feature and how it came to be

(27:13) How recommendations have led to an increase of millions of subscribers

(31:34) Moving forward with network-driven discovery 

(32:17) The “build with” principle and the product lab at Substack

(35:02) How Substack deals with negative press

(36:45) The writer experience at Substack

(39:13) The reader-focused experience on Substack

(40:41) Advice for writers

(44:45) Substack’s vision for making creation easier

(46:39) Common mistakes creators make, and how product improvements could help in some cases 

(49:57) Why you’re not too late to join the game

(52:52) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Barbra Gago is the founder and CEO of Pando, where she’s democratizing career progression. Previously she worked as the Chief Marketing Officer and Global Head of Marketing at Miro, where she helped create an entirely new software category for the space, and also served as VP of Marketing at Greenhouse, where she led go-to-market strategy. In today’s episode, we cover three main topics: category creation, branding and rebranding, and building opinionated software. Barbra discusses how she was able to rebrand Miro and launch a whole new category—and why her attempt to do that at Greenhouse failed. We cover the benefits of building your own category, and when it makes sense to do so and when it doesn’t. She also shares the importance of getting to know your users, why a great brand is informed by its values, and why Pando is built in an opinionated way.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/category-creation-and-brand-building-barbra-gago-pando-miro-greenhouse-culture-amp/#transcript

—

Where to find Barbra Gago:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/barbragago

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/barbragago

• Pando: https://www.pando.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=oct27

• Stytch: https://stytch.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• G2: https://g2.com/

• Software Advice: https://www.softwareadvice.com/

• Marketo: https://www.marketo.com/

• HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/

• Gainsight: https://www.gainsight.com/

• Greenhouse: https://www.greenhouse.io/

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Gartner: https://www.gartner.com/

• Forrester: https://www.forrester.com/research/product-management/

• Oyster: https://www.oysterhr.com/

• Deel: https://www.deel.com/

• Atlassian: https://www.atlassian.com/

• Radical Candor: Be a Kick-Ass Boss Without Losing Your Humanity: https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Candor-Revised-Kick-Ass-Humanity/dp/1250235375

• The Art of War: https://www.amazon.com/Art-War-Sun-Tzu/dp/1590302257

• Kafka on the Shore: https://www.amazon.com/Kafka-Shore-Haruki-Murakami/dp/0099458322

• Cautionary Tales podcast: https://timharford.com/articles/cautionarytales/

• The Sandman on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81150303

• Nancy Duarte on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nancyduarte/

• Al Gore’s TED Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/al_gore_the_new_urgency_of_climate_change

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:04) Barbra’s background

(05:06) Barbra’s startup

(06:07) Category creation vs. winning in existing categories

(07:49) What is an applicant tracking system, and why have they been problematic?

(09:57) What is a product category?

(13:06) Examples of product categories

(14:05) Greenhouse as an example of failed category creation 

(16:46) How Miro successfully created a new category

(18:37) Utilizing user feedback

(21:15) The mechanics of category creation

(21:22) How to advocate for your new category with directory sites

(25:53) The middle ground between new and existing categories

(29:37) When is it time to rebrand?

(38:51) How to create a lasting, global brand

(41:18) How values inform brands

(43:13) Insights into developing company values

(44:24) The elements of a brand

(46:37) What is opinionated software?

(47:57) The benefits of opinionated software, and why Barbra’s software is opinionated

(51:23) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Fareed Mosavat is Chief Development Officer at Reforge, where he leads production, content, and new-product experiences. Previously, he led growth and product teams at Slack and Instacart, was a GM at Zynga, and also served as VP of Product at RunKeeper. Before all of that, Fareed’s fascinating career began in engineering for Pixar, where he learned the art of storytelling and collaboration. In today’s episode, we talk about how his time at Pixar influenced the way he thinks about product, why it’s so difficult to become a better PM, and how to avoid the “manager death spiral.” Fareed shares important insights on how to earn the trust of your manager and coworkers, the four types of product work—and why you need to understand all four. He also provides solid examples of how to generalize your learnings and explains why this will expand your options, make you a better PM, and boost your chances of moving into a leadership role. 

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/how-to-build-trust-and-grow-as-a-product-leader-fareed-mosavat-reforge-slack-instacart-zynga-pixar/#transcript

—

Where to find Fareed Mosavat:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/far33d

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fareed/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Naval Ravikant’s Twitter thread about specific knowledge: https://twitter.com/naval/status/1002104865919664128

• Merci Grace on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/merci-grace-ex-head-of-growth-at-slack-on-plg-interviewing-storytelling-building-a-diverse-team-hiring-salespeople-building-a-growth-team-and-much-more/

• “Crossing the Canyon: Product Manager to Product Leader,” by Fareed Mosavat and Casey Winters: https://www.reforge.com/blog/crossing-the-canyon-product-manager-to-product-leader

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within-your-company-casey-winters-eventbrite/

• Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:38) Fareed’s background

(03:55) Lessons from Pixar

(09:07) What Fareed does at Reforge

(11:57) The scale of Reforge at this time

(13:51) Why it’s so difficult to become a better PM

(18:03) A PM pie chart—execution, generalizing your solutions, communication, and scaling

(23:00) How creating trust helped Fareed’s career grow

(26:24) How to gain trust by leveraging your curiosity and communication skills

(33:50) How to move from PM to Product Lead

(36:43) The manager death spiral and how to avoid it

(40:43) The four types of product work

(44:13) Moving from IC to product manager 

(47:15) How to ask for the proper resources

(50:00) The trend of senior PMs diversifying into advising, teaching, and angel investing

(57:20) The downsides of being your own boss

(01:00:45) Advice for breaking into advising

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Adriel Frederick is VP of Product Management at Reddit X, where he helps incubate and scale new products. He is a former Product Lead at Facebook, as well as a former PM and Director of Product at Lyft. In today’s episode, we focus on what it takes to become a better product leader. Adriel shares anecdotes from his time at Lyft and Facebook, insights about how to lead through tough times, why there isn’t an algorithmic solution to everything, why R&D teams need to be a part of the core mission, the tangible benefits of working on diverse teams, and his thoughts on the future of AI. He also introduces the concept of cannonballs, why you should focus on the marginal user, why organization and empathy are the most important PM skills, and so much more.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/humanizing-product-development-adriel-frederick-reddit-lyft-facebook/#transcript

—

Where to find Adriel Frederick:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/drellf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adrielfrederick/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Linear: https://linear.app/lenny

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Jules Walter on Twitter: https://twitter.com/julesdwalt

• Jules Walter’s guest post on Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/product-sense

• Mark Zuckerberg on The Joe Rogan Experience: https://open.spotify.com/episode/51gxrAActH18RGhKNza598

• Sam Harris’s TED Talk on AI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nt3edWLgIg

• Facebook’s 7 friends in 10 days: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/how-chamath-palihapitya-dramatically-improved-user-malinda-senanayake/

• The Prize: The Epic Quest for Oil, Money & Power: https://www.amazon.com/Prize-Epic-Quest-Money-Power/dp/1439110123/

• The New Map: Energy, Climate, and the Clash of Nations: https://www.amazon.com/New-Map-Energy-Climate-Nations/dp/0143111159/

• Revisionist History podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/revisionist-history/id1119389968

• Tuned In podcast: https://www.hpacademy.com/blog/tuned-in-high-performance-academy-podcast/

• Mo on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81134264

• Radiant Nuclear: https://www.radiantnuclear.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:40) Adriel’s background

(06:13) What he does at Reddit X

(07:27) Reddit X’s avatar marketplace and NFTs

(08:33) Why R&D teams need to be a part of the core mission

(11:12) What it’s like to be the first black PM at Facebook

(14:58) How to foster diversity

(19:40) Being a PM at controversial companies, and how to evaluate criticism

(28:25) Adriel’s most stressful time at Lyft

(30:35) The importance of operational control and what it means

(32:35) Why there isn’t always an algorithmic solution to everything

(37:47) Thoughts on AI

(42:42) Growth hacking and algorithms at Facebook

(48:18) Cannonballs in growth—fundamental changes in the product for optimization

(49:07) Facebook’s “7 friends in 10 days” push

(51:30) What is a marginal user, and what can you learn from their experience?

(56:06) How to think about doing experiments

(59:10) Why organization and empathy are the most important skills 

(1:02:59) Lightning round 

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Janna Bastow is a former product manager, and currently the CEO and co-founder of ProdPad. She also co-founded Mind the Product, a community for PMs, which has grown to 300,000 members across the world. In today’s podcast, Janna discusses the limitations of timeline-based Gantt charts and her “Now/Next/Later” framework. She also shares stories about hosting conferences and gives some great tips on how to improve your presentation skills and cope with performance anxiety.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-better-product-roadmaps-janna-bastow-mind-the-product-prodpad/#transcript

—

Where to find Janna Bastow:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/simplybastow

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jannabastow

• The ProdPad newsletter: https://www.prodpad.com/newsletter/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Formsort: https://formsort.com/lenny

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

—

Referenced:

• Mind the Product: https://www.mindtheproduct.com/

• The Trouble with Traditional Roadmaps: https://www.prodpad.com/resources/guides/ditch-the-timeline-roadmap/the-trouble-with-traditional-timeline-roadmaps/

• ProdPad’s Sandbox: https://www.prodpad.com/sandbox/

• Geoffrey Moore’s product vision template: https://www.prodpad.com/blog/product-vision-template/

• The Art of Profitability: https://www.amazon.com/Art-Profitability-Adrian-Slywotzky/dp/0446692271

• The Sandman on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81150303

• Startups for the Rest of Us podcast: https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/

• Christina Wodtke on Twitter: https://twitter.com/cwodtke

—

In this episode, we cover:

(01:10) Janna’s background

(05:28) How the community evolved at Mind the Product

(08:22) The tricky logistics of putting together a conference

(10:48) Are conferences profitable?

(13:00) How Janna developed her storytelling and presentation skills

(16:44) How to fight performance anxiety

(19:25) Mistakes are humanizing—how to power through and deliver your presentation

(22:11) The limitations of traditional timeline roadmaps

(25:00) Janna’s Now/Next/Later framework

(28:08) How to work without the structure of dated timelines, and why soft launches are important

(32:57) What great product teams are doing well

(35:05) The importance of retrospectives

(36:45) How to shift the culture at larger companies

(39:43) How ProdPad creates better product management practices

(42:04) How to learn the Now/Next/Later framework

(46:59) Geoffrey Moore’s product vision template

(48:36) Lessons for PMs interested in becoming founders

(50:48) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Adam Fishman has decades of experience building and scaling some incredible businesses, like Lyft, Patreon, and Imperfect Foods. He is currently an Executive in Residence at Reforge and an advisor to numerous companies on growth, product, strategy, and company building. In today’s episode, Adam shares his growth PM competency model to help founders identify specific skills when hiring growth leaders, how to structure feedback, and how to identify gaps in your growth team. He also discusses the role of onboarding in retention and how to evaluate a company as a prospective employee.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-build-a-high-performing-growth-team-adam-fishman-patreon-lyft-imperfect-foods/#transcript

—

Where to find Adam Fishman:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/fishmanaf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adamjfishman/

• Website: https://www.adamfishman.com/

• Adam’s newsletter: https://www.fishmanafnewsletter.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Linear: https://linear.app/lenny

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Stream Super Pumped on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/super-pumped

• Super Pumped: The Battle for Uber: https://www.amazon.com/Super-Pumped-Battle-Mike-Isaac/dp/0393652246

•  HitRecord: https://hitrecord.org/

• Adam’s growth competency model: https://www.reforge.com/blog/the-growth-competency-model

• Adam’s LinkedIn series: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/adamjfishman_ive-now-published-my-complete-series-on-activity-6979198793992802305-VtCu/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:18) Adam’s background

(06:16) Lyft’s launch press release 

(09:56) Adam’s newsletter and growth competency framework

(10:34) Myths and mistakes founders make

(15:12) The growth competency model 

(18:47) Customer knowledge and user psychology

(21:23) Why strategy and communication are more advanced competencies

(25:45) Why to hire a junior-level growth executive and how to support them

(31:20) Why Adam skews toward internal hiring

(33:25) Generalists vs. specialists

(35:59) The importance of onboarding

(41:49) Opinionated defaults

(45:03) Balancing conversion and retention with successful onboarding

(48:46) Guidelines for redesigning onboarding

(52:22) The PMF criteria for candidates

(57:57) What Adam would have done differently at Imperfect Foods

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Dan Hockenmaier is an expert on marketplace strategy and growth. He was previously the Director of Growth at Thumbtack as well as a partner at Reforge, where he co-created the monetization track. Currently, he is the Head of Strategy and Analytics at Faire. In today’s episode, Dan shares the building blocks of a growth model, important considerations when building your growth model, and how to get started. We also chat about retention best practices, the complexity of building a marketplace, the future of marketplaces, and when it makes sense to add a SaaS business to a marketplace, and vice versa.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/developing-a-growth-model-marketplace-growth-strategy-dan-hockenmaier-faire-thumbtack-reforge/#transcript

—

Where to find Dan Hockenmaier:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/danhockenmaier

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dan-hock/

• Website: https://www.danhock.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within-your-company

• Faire: https://www.faire.com/

• Dan’s blog post on the future of marketplaces: https://www.danhock.com/posts/the-future-of-marketplaces

• Careers at Faire: https://www.faire.com/careers

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:43) Dan’s background

(04:01) What is a growth model?

(07:20) The building blocks of a growth model for your own business

(10:22) The value in building your own model

(11:12) The importance of retention over growth 

(14:49) Getting started building your model

(19:18) The growth model at Thumbtack

(20:36) The importance of the early user experience for retention

(25:02) Why is a marketplace a good business?

(28:23) Health metrics for marketplaces

(33:47) Supply and demand, and why you shouldn’t neglect demand

(36:23) The role of ROI equations and how to use them

(39:16) Why you should tread lightly when working with marketplaces

(42:43) Expanding marketplaces

(46:50) How marketplaces can add a SaaS offering, and why adding a marketplace to a SaaS business is trickier

(49:47) When is there an opportunity to unbundle?

(54:43) B2B marketplaces 

(56:36) What is fragmentation?

(58:46) The future of marketplaces

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Kristen Berman is the CEO and co-founder of Irrational Labs, where she helps companies like Google, Airbnb, PayPal, Microsoft, and LinkedIn improve their products and services through behavioral design research. She is also the co-founder of Common Cents Lab, a Duke University initiative dedicated to improving the financial well-being of low- to middle-class Americans. In today’s episode, Kristen shares the 3B Framework of Behavioral Design and uses real-life examples to illustrate what influences behavior change and the common biases that get in the way of building successful products. She also explains how to keep users engaged and how you can implement behavioral design research to drive innovation and growth.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/using-behavioral-science-to-improve-your-product-kristen-berman-irrational-labs/#transcript

—

Where to find Kristen Berman:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/bermster

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristenberman/

• Website: https://irrationallabs.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny

• Lenny’s Job Board: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

—

Referenced:

Learn more behavioral science:

• 3B Behavioral Design Framework https://miro.com/miroverse/3b-behavioral-design-framework

• Irrational Labs newsletter, with latest BE and behavioral design insights: https://irrationallabs.com/newsletter/ 

• Join the Behavioral Design Online Bootcamp (use code “Lenny” for 10% off): https://behavioraleconomicsbootcamp.com/

• Get the 3B Framework: https://irrationallabs.com/3bs-download/

• Behavioral Design & Diagnosis Cheat Sheet: https://irrationallabs.com/download-behavioral-design-guide/

• The 16 Critical Cognitive Biases (Plus Key Academic Research): https://irrationallabs.com/blog/cognitive-biases-and-academic-research/

• Behavioral Game Design: 7 Lessons: https://irrationallabs.com/blog/behavioral-game-design-7-lessons-from-behavioral-science-to-help-change-user-behavior/

• Predictably Irrational: The Hidden Forces That Shape Our Decisions:  https://www.amazon.com/Predictably-Irrational-Revised-Expanded-Decisions/dp/0061353248/

• Prolific testing platform: https://www.prolific.co/

• Kristen’s guest post on Lenny’s Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/people/23170097-kristen-berman

• Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion: https://www.amazon.com/Influence-New-Expanded-Psychology-Persuasion/dp/0062937650

• The Darwin Economy: Liberty, Competition, and the Common Good: https://www.amazon.com/Darwin-Economy-Liberty-Competition-Common/dp/0691156689/

• The Science of Change podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-science-of-change/id1587407079

• No Stupid Questions podcast: https://freakonomics.com/series/nsq/

• Stream The Rehearsal on HBO Max: https://www.hbo.com/the-rehearsal

• Chris York’s website: https://www.chrisyork.co/

Case studies mentioned: 

• Budgeting fintech: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/budgeting/

• TikTok: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/tiktok-how-behavioral-science-reduced-the-spread-of-misinformation/

• One Medical: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/one-medical-case-study/

• Credit Karma: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/behavioral-design-credit-karma-money/

• TytoCare: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/tytocare-virtual-medical-visits/

• Kiva: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/mind-guest-blog/the-deadline-made-me-do-it/

• When to Make Your Sign-Up Flow Harder: https://irrationallabs.com/blog/its-not-always-about-making-things-easier-when-to-make-your-sign-up-flow-harder/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:54) What is Irrational Labs, and what do they do?

(05:45) What are behavioral economics and behavioral design?

(06:50) The fintech budgeting experiment

(10:46) What drives behavior change?

(11:35) Why increasing friction can sometimes increase conversion

(13:51) How to ask the right questions for user engagement

(16:09) How Kristen got her start in behavioral economics

(18:10) The 3B model of behavior change

(20:37) Cognitive barriers

(22:02) The importance of building products with immediate benefits to the user

(24:20) How exploitation can occur

(26:45) How to set customer-friendly incentives

(29:15) How Kristen reduced the sharing of misinformation on TikTok

(31:58) Tips for researching and solving problems

(35:36) The One Medical case study 

(38:31) Rules of thumb for improving flow

(41:46) What is right-for-wrong?

(47:00) How to get started using behavioral design

(49:33) The Behavioral Design Bootcamp

(52:01) Lightning round!

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Georgiana Laudi is the co-founder and CEO of a consulting agency called Forget The Funnel, where she helps SaaS companies scale and improve conversion rates through customer-led growth. She’s also a marketing and growth advisor to companies like MarketerHire, SparkToro, and Sprout Social. Previously, she was the VP of Marketing at Unbounce and has worked in growth marketing for over 20 years. In today’s episode, Gia speaks about how to identify your ideal customer, how to map their user flows in order to find the biggest growth opportunities, and examples of product changes she’s recommended that have led to the largest growth unlocks. She shares the exact process she works through with founders to uncover opportunities, as well as how to increase subscriptions and retention for SaaS businesses.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/customer-led-growth-georgiana-laudi-forget-the-funnel/#transcript

—

Where to find Georgiana Laudi:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ggiiaa

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/georgianalaudi/

• Website: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Maven: https://www.maven.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• How SaaS Marketers Can Hold High-Impact Customer Research Interviews: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/resources/saas-customer-research-interviews

• Jobs To Be Done: Email Invite Template & Interview Questions by Forget The Funnel: https://docs.google.com/document/d/183PzYjQi2vsIRlPMUrtzRwZF1VdnZWNDAZsrJ4MRT4Q/edit

• The Growth Framework for Customer-Obsessed SaaS Teams: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/resources/saas-customer-journey-mapping

• Project Snow White: https://marker.medium.com/what-seven-years-at-airbnb-taught-me-about-building-a-company-e1d035d49c56#:~:text=middle%2C%20an[…]0White,-was%20one%20of

• Startupfest: https://startupfestival.com/for-startups/

• Pirate Metrics: https://fourweekmba.com/pirate-metrics/

• How Airbnb Proved That Storytelling Is the Most Important Skill in Design: https://www.inc.com/yazin-akkawi/the-surprising-technique-airbnb-uses-to-better-sell-an-experience.html

• Jobs to Be Done: https://jtbd.info/

• Demand-Side Sales 101: https://www.amazon.com/Demand-Side-Sales-101-Customers-Progress/dp/1544509987

• When Coffee and Kale Compete: https://www.amazon.com/When-Coffee-Kale-Compete-products-ebook/dp/B07C7HH662

• Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning So Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It: https://www.amazon.com/Obviously-Awesome-Product-Positioning-Customers/dp/1999023005

• Hooked: How to Build Habit-Forming Products: https://www.amazon.com/Hooked-How-Build-Habit-Forming-Products/dp/1591847788

• Forget the Funnel: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/customer-led-growth/book

• Four Thousand Weeks: Time Management for Mortals: https://www.amazon.com/Four-Thousand-Weeks-Management-Mortals/dp/B08XZY5ZF7

• Shine Theory: https://www.shinetheory.com/

• April Dunford’s website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

• SparkToro: https://sparktoro.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:33) Georgiana’s background

(07:03) Why funnels are antiquated 

(08:52) Better positioning and messaging to find the ideal customer

(13:59) How Gia was inspired by Airbnb’s storytelling

(19:23) How to analyze what’s successful and what to invest in

(21:54) The ideal customer to learn from

(26:37) How to choose which customer job to prioritize 

(32:21) Value moments in the customer relationship

(36:45) Applying customer feedback 

(44:40) Metrics for measuring the customer’s meaningful engagement 

(49:45) What’s included in the messaging and positioning guidebook

(51:15) Tips for messaging

(54:13) Example of a customer job at SparkToro

(55:58) What is the Jobs to Be Done framework?

(59:50) Lightning round

(1:04:18) How Gia manages her time

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Julian Shapiro is widely known as the founder of Demand Curve, where he’s helped thousands of companies figure out their growth strategy. He also wrote the growth marketing column at TechCrunch, was CMO at Webflow, and even created an animation engine called Velocity that’s now used in apps like Uber and WhatsApp. In today’s episode, Julian dives deep on product-led acquisition (PLA) and why he believes it’s the best way to grow your company. He shares specific marketing strategies for growth and retention and speaks about his framework for creating novel, engaging content, and how to choose topics for that content. He also discusses a framework called the Curiosity Faucet, inspired by prolific creators such as Ed Sheeran, John Mayer, Taylor Swift, and Neil Gaiman, to help you unlock your own creativity.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/growth-tactics-retention-strategies-and-becoming-a-better-writer-julian-shapiro-demand-curve-hyper-webflow-techcrunch/#transcript

—

Where to find Julian Shapiro:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/Julian

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/julian-shapiro/

• Website: https://www.julian.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Paul Graham’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/paulg

• Julian’s guide on startup growth channels: https://www.julian.com/guide/startup/growth-channels

• Topic selection: https://www.julian.com/guide/write/ideas

• Product-led acquisition: https://www.julian.com/guide/startup/product-led-acquisition

• Novelty: https://www.julian.capital/growth-strategy/content-marketing

• Julian’s example of counter-narrative novelty: https://twitter.com/julian/status/1348001396277186560

• Julian’s example of counterintuitive novelty: https://twitter.com/julian/status/1348001397753532416  

• On Writing Well: The Classic Guide to Writing Nonfiction:   https://www.amazon.com/Writing-Well-Classic-Guide-Nonfiction/dp/0060891548/

• Neil Gaiman Teaches the Art of Storytelling: https://www.masterclass.com/classes/neil-gaiman-teaches-the-art-of-storytelling

• Ed Sheeran, Songwriter: https://music.apple.com/us/music-movie/songwriter/1411353855

• John Mayer describes his songwriting process: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cNRDWEXnrQ

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:42) Julian’s background

(04:46) Why Julian hasn’t been tweeting frequently

(07:43) Advice for building a Twitter following

(09:53) The main reason Julian creates handbooks

(11:33) The difference between e-handbooks and newsletters

(13:25) What is product-led acquisition?

(16:20) The categories of product-led acquisition

(22:31) What is billboarding, and how can you take advantage of it?

(25:56) UGC—leveraging user-generated content for free advertising

(29:33) Strategies for retaining users

(38:36) How to keep novelty high in writing

(45:50) Julian’s framework for choosing writing topics

(54:35) The creativity faucet—how to unclog your pipes and get it going

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Jason Shah has led product teams at Amazon, Airbnb, Microsoft, and Yammer and currently leads the product team at Alchemy (one of the most important web3 infrastructure companies). In addition, he’s an advisor, investor, and two-time founder. In today’s episode, Jason discusses what it’s like to be a PM in web3, why his role at Amazon made such a big impact on his life and career, what makes a great leader, and how to hire well. He also shares his unique perspective on building a meaningful career and life.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-a-meaningful-career-jason-shah-airbnb-amazon-microsoft-alchemy/#transcript—Where to find Jason Shah:• Twitter: https://twitter.com/jasonyogeshshah• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonyogeshshah/• Website: https://www.jasonshah.me/—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/—Referenced:• Creative Selection: Inside Apple’s Design Process During the Golden Age of Steve Jobs: https://www.amazon.com/Creative-Selection-Inside-Apples-Process/dp/1250194466• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within#details• Jason Shah in Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/a-product-managers-guide-to-web3• The Hard Thing About Hard Things: Building a Business When There Are No Easy Answers: https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Thing-About-Things-Building/dp/0062273205• Polygon: https://polygon.technology/• Solana: https://solana.com/• MoonPay: https://www.moonpay.com/• The Vietnam War series by Ken Burns: https://www.pbs.org/show/vietnam-war/• Alchemy: https://www.alchemy.com/—In this episode, we cover:(04:31) Jason’s background(08:19) The current state of web3(12:44) The evolution of product management in web3(15:27) The value of a great product manager(18:11) Why Amazon was a great learning experience (20:25) A look into Amazon’s process on working backward(23:55) How to communicate clearly(28:17) Working backward from excitement(32:46) What makes a great leader(38:26) How to influence a CEO or founder’s direction (46:19) The career ladder vs. career map framework(52:27) When to follow a new opportunity vs. when to stick it out(58:50) How to hire the right people(1:03:47) What skill is most important for product managers(1:06:49) Lightning round!—Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquires about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Adam Grenier is the former Head of Growth Marketing and Innovation at Uber, where he helped build Uber’s growth infrastructure from the ground up. He is also the former VP of Product and Marketing at LambdaSchool, and former VP of Marketing at Masterclass. These days, Adam is a growth and marketing advisor to many companies, as well as a teacher through Reforge. In today’s episode, Adam shares how to determine whether a new channel is worth exploring, the rise of the growth CMO, and how improv classes can improve team bonding and create a more positive ‘yes’ culture. He also speaks candidly about his own struggles with burnout and depression and shares some incredible tools that have helped him along the way.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/when-and-how-to-invest-in-new-acquisition-channels-adam-grenier-uber-masterclass/#transcript—Where to find Adam Grenier:• Twitter: https://twitter.com/AKGrenier• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/akgrenier/—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/—Referenced:• OOT: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over-the-top_media_service• Grin: https://grin.co/• Crossing the Chasm: Marketing and Selling High-Tech Products to Mainstream Customers: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-Marketing-High-Tech-Mainstream/dp/0060517123•Hacking Marketing: Agile Practices to Make Marketing Smarter, Faster, and More Innovative:  https://www.amazon.com/Hacking-Marketing-Practices-Smarter-Innovative/dp/1119183170• Adam’s twitter thread about burnout: https://twitter.com/akgrenier/status/1285275433282359296•Why Buddhism is True: https://www.amazon.com/Why-Buddhism-True-Philosophy-Enlightenment/dp/1439195455—In this episode, we cover:(00:35) Adam’s background(05:34) How improv can improve creativity and collaboration(13:09) What we’ll cover in this episode(13:52) Determining when an acquisition channel is a good match(25:38) Advice for how long to test a new channel(30:11) Emerging platforms that are worth exploring(36:53) Influencer marketing tools(37:55) When to broaden your audience(41:22) What is a Growth CMO?(49:36) Why marketing leaders should learn product development(51:32) Red flags that your CMO isn’t a good fit(55:33) Dealing with depression and burnout(1:03:00) Tools to help you through difficult times(1:05:20) Signs you’re facing burnout(1:07:15) What’s next for Adam—Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquires about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Emily Kramer led and built the marketing teams at Asana, Carta, Ticketfly, and Astro (acquired by Slack). These days, she’s the co-founder of MKT1, where she helps founders and marketers build and scale their marketing functions. Emily is also a well-respected angel investor and writes my favorite marketing newsletter (MKT1). In today’s episode, she shares her insights on when to hire marketers, how to determine which type of marketing hire is best for your team, how to best work with marketing, and what red flags to look for. Emily shares actionable templates and some incredible frameworks that are sure to expand your marketing knowledge.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-build-a-powerful-marketing-machine-emily-kramer-asana-carta-mkt1/#transcript

—

Where to find Emily Kramer:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/emilykramer

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emilykramer/

• MKT1 Newsletter: https://mkt1.substack.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Lenny’s Job Board: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Building an efficient marketing machine: the fuel & the engine: https://mkt1.substack.com/p/fuel-engine

• The GACC Marketing Brief: https://mkt1.substack.com/p/the-gacc-marketing-brief-the-best

• The Tipping Point: How Little Things Can Make a Big Difference: https://www.amazon.com/Tipping-Point-Little-Things-Difference/dp/0316346624

• Crossing the Chasm: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-3rd-Disruptive-Mainstream/dp/0062292986/

• Purple Cow: Transform Your Business by Being Remarkable: https://www.amazon.com/Purple-Cow-Transform-Business-Remarkable/dp/014101640X

• All the Light We Cannot See: https://www.amazon.com/All-Light-We-Cannot-See/dp/1501173219/

• The Daily podcast: https://www.nytimes.com/column/the-daily

• Stream Yellowjackets on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/yellowjackets

• CODA on Apple TV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/movie/coda/umc.cmc.3eh9r5iz32ggdm4ccvw5igiir

• Ashley Mayer’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashleymayer/

• Kevan Lee’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevanlee/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:44) Emily’s background

(06:08) Hiring a marketing team

(11:26) Examples of fuel and engine in marketing

(16:00) What is a product marketer?

(18:20) Why you should start with a marketing generalist 

(20:30) The difference between a growth person and a product person 

(23:57) What to look for in a product marketer

(26:58) When to hire a marketing person

(30:45) The role of a brand marketer

(33:24) Marketing for PLG startups

(36:22) What is product-led growth?

(39:23) How to get product and marketing to collaborate 

(43:38) What is the GACC framework?

(47:58 ) How to know if your marketing team is effective

(54:33) Why founders need angel investors with functional expertise

(1:00:23) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquires about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ryan J. Salva is the VP of Product at GitHub, where he led the incubation and launch of Copilot. Copilot uses OpenAI’s ML engine to suggest code and entire functions in real time, right from your editor, and is changing the way we build software. Ryan is an experienced developer and product manager, with over a decade of experience working for Microsoft before moving to lead the GitHub product team. In today’s episode, he shares how Copilot got its start, how it moved from prototype to live product, and how he structures R&D teams within larger companies. He also discusses the ethical questions surrounding AI use and how to build a successful product team, and shares the inside story of the development of Copilot.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-role-of-ai-in-new-product-development-ryan-j-salva-vp-of-product-at-github-copilot/#transcript

—

Where to find Ryan J. Salva:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ryanjsalva

• LinkedIn : https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanjsalva/

• Website: http://www.ryanjsalva.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Modern Treasury: https://www.moderntreasury.com/

—

Referenced:

• GitHub Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilot

• Make It So: Interaction Design Lessons from Science Fiction: https://www.amazon.com/Make-So-Interaction-Lessons-Science/dp/1933820985

• Brief Interviews with Hideous Men: https://www.amazon.com/Brief-Interviews-Hideous-Foster-Wallace/dp/0316925195

• The Memory Palace podcast: https://thememorypalace.us/

• Arrival: https://www.hulu.com/movie/arrival-6ec67b11-b282-4383-85ac-38c4731b40e4

• Oege De Moor’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/oegedemoor/

—

In this episode, we cover:

[04:39] Ryan’s background and how he became involved in development

[10:46] What is GitHub Copilot?

[14:44] How GitHub Copilot can be utilized for education

[17:46] How GitHub incorporated AI models with computer languages

[27:24] Project horizons: delegating tasks based on confidence levels

[30:39] How to put together a development team for “moonshots”

[35:22] When and how to transition your R&D team smoothly

[38:28] Dealing with ethical issues surrounding AI

[44:40] The future of AI in development

[48:48] Challenges with scaling Copilot

[54:23] Allocating your energy as products scale

[58:17] Lightning round 

—

Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

Yuriy Timen was Global Head of Marketing and Growth at Grammarly, and is now a full-time growth advisor, having worked with more than a dozen companies, including Canva, Airtable, Whimsical, Otter.ai, Oyster, Flo Health, and Clay. In today’s episode, Yuriy discusses the ever-changing world of growth, emerging growth tactics, and how to find your growth engine. You’ll learn the most effective strategies for driving user acquisition, how to balance and diversify organic and paid channels, when it’s time to change plans, how to vet new growth channel opportunities, and much more.—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-grow-a-subscription-business-yuriy-timen-grammarly-canva-airtable/#transcript

—Where to find Yuriy Timen:• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yuriytimen/• Twitter: https://twitter.com/thetimenator—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny• Modern Treasury: https://www.moderntreasury.com/• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/—Referenced:• Casey Winters: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caseywinters/• Elena Verna: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elenaverna/• Lyka Pet Food: https://lyka.com.au/• Ethan Smith’s LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethanls/• Graphite: https://www.graphitehq.com/• Recast: https://getrecast.com/• Measured: https://www.measured.com/• INCRMNTAL: https://www.incrmntal.com/• Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less: https://www.amazon.com/Essentialism-Disciplined-Pursuit-Greg-McKeown/dp/0804137382/• Man’s Search for Meaning: https://www.amazon.com/Mans-Search-Meaning-Viktor-Frankl/dp/0807014273/• The Splendid and the Vile: A Saga of Churchill, Family, and Defiance During the Blitz: https://www.amazon.com/Splendid-Vile-Churchill-Family-Defiance/dp/0385348711/• The All-In Podcast: https://www.allinpodcast.co/• Hustle: https://www.netflix.com/title/80242342• Mark Fiske at H.I.G.: https://higgrowth.com/team/mark-fiske/—In this episode, we cover:[03:49] Yuriy’s background[09:46] Different paths to growth for subscription-based products[13:21] When to lean into virality[15:39] What are network effects?[16:32] SEO strategy and timeline: how long can it take to see results?[24:22] The shifting landscape of paid media[28:09] The return of media mix modeling[32:01] How can you tell if media spending equates to business results?[33:44] Don’t spread yourself too thin[36:01] How to tell if you’ve taken a strategy far enough[38:02] When to lean into a strategy that’s working vs. when to think about diversification[42:13] Is there a shift from growth to survival?[46:19] Two reasons to do paid media[56:45] Why you shouldn’t dismiss TikTok (and other channels you might be overlooking)[59:36] Lightning round!—Production and marketing: https://penname.co/